Racist Clubs ?

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Racist clubs ? May 27, 2006
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Source: Gulf News

Where races don't club together

By Diaa Hadid, Staff Reporter


It's a case of all dressed up, but nowhere to go. Many expatriates claim they arrive at the door of a club only to be told they can't enter. The management says the place is for couples only or entry is through reservation. But these clubbers cry out that they are turned away because of their race.

When the three Indian couples were told they needed reservations to a bar in an iconic Dubai hotel last month, one of them called management to book.

As the well-dressed couples waited, another European group arrived.

"Six pairs of ears" heard they had not made reservations either, said Avinash Sampath, one of the waiting men. The door manager checked a clipboard and let the Europeans in. "They are regulars," he explained.

And another European couple, without reservations, "overheard by the same set of six ears" also entered. "One of us did tell [the manager] he was being racist. Hearing which, he boldly shined his flash-light on our faces," Sampath said.

Meanwhile, the Indian man trying to make reservations over the phone was told he did not need to make any that night. After all six well-paid professionals wrote complaint letters, the hotel's general manager said the European couples were guests at a sister property.

The Indian couples were not convinced, but Sampath said there was no more he could do. "They have their story, we have ours," he said.

Stories

Many Dubai residents have stories like Sampath's at the city's approximate 600 pubs and clubs. And like Sampath's story, it is difficult to tell whether racism is at its heart, when most pubs and clubs have a reservations and couples-only policy that is applied at whim, with no clear guidelines involved for customers.

Adam, a part-Asian IT specialist, was denied entry at a popular expatriate club when he tried to enter to meet a waiting friend."The bouncer said it was for couples and reservations. But I saw two white guys walk in," he said.

Edward, a black British media professional, was charged Dh50 the first time he walked into to a popular Bur Dubai pub.

The next time, when he entered "with some white friends, we walked right in without paying". "Once a group of Lebanese and Europeans were at a hotel resort with many clubs. Our Indian colleague, who turned up later, wasn't allowed in," said Jamil, a Lebanese presenter.

Almost all people interviewed by Gulf News said they had either seen friends and colleagues treated in a racist manner, or experienced it themselves. They also consistently mentioned five hotspots known for preferring a European clientele.

Campaign

In 1999, Dubai Tourism Commerce Marketing (DTCM) carried out a campaign against pubs and clubs that denied people entry on a racial basis.

That included sending out a circular that told club and pub operators they could not "impose any entry restrictions relating to the race, colour or profession of their guests and customers".

Lina Makarem Dergham, Senior Business Development Manager at DTCM, said she was surprised at racism claims, and said the department had not received one complaint this year on the issue.

Last year, the department received 8 complaints, but not all were because of racism. When Gulf News suggested few people complained because they were not aware they could complain to DTCM, Lina said the department tried to raise awareness.

"We hand out information pamphlets to tourists on package tours. We used to have complaint boxes, but nobody used them," she said. DTCM had ruled out advertising their number on pub and club entrances.

"We were concerned that we would get a flood of calls from drunk people with no legitimate problems," she said, "and we don't have the staff numbers to deal with that."

She encouraged people who felt they had been discriminated against to contact DTCM.

The fine

Clubs found guilty of doing so may be charged up to Dh20,000 and face temporary or permanent closure.

In 2003, DTCM issued another circular, asking pubs and clubs to "clearly post entry rules in Arabic and English at the door entrance of outlets?" and "issue complimentary membership cars to regular guests to avoid misunderstanding".

Our survey

A random Gulf News survey found very few clubs and pubs followed the DTCM guidelines. "Of course they won't," said Edward, "that means they won't be able to pick and choose who they want."

Even though racism is difficult to prove, Dubai residents say they often go out with a sense of anxiety ? will they be allowed in, or not?

"There are businessmen here who are willing to spend thousands on a good night out, stay at five star hotels, but aren't allowed into clubs. It doesn't make business sense," said Ahmad, a Pakistani national. "Who knows how much money these places are losing?"

?Not racism'

Club owners and workers vigorously denied they discriminated because of race.

The owner of a popular Arab nightclub said his rules were clear. "We prefer people over 30, they should be couples or mixed groups and have reservations," he said.

The owner said when bouncers denied entry to groups of men, they were accused of racism.

?Cheap excuse'

"I think that's a cheap excuse. We don't let in men without women, that's all. Single men come in to find ladies, but what kind of ladies do they want? And if they don't find any, and get drunk, how will they behave?"

He said the situation was more delicate when they did not allow women to enter alone. "There are certain working women who want to enter my club for business. I don't let them in. I want ladies to feel comfortable in my club."

Too busy

A marketing manager for a hotel with several clubs said they were not racist, but often too busy to let people in.

"I do understand how somebody can feel if they are not let in," she said, "but our policy is very clear. We allow couples and with reservations only, and members of the hotel". She said the hotel "should put guidelines in front of more places" to let people know if they were eligible to enter, but so far, had not done so for most clubs.

Helping women

A manager of another popular expatriate club said their policy was not discriminatory, but aimed at keeping women comfortable.

"I want an environment where women can wear what they want, dance and have a good time, and feel comfortable and relaxed."

"We don't encourage men in groups," she said, "we try to keep it to couples only, otherwise violence can break out between groups of men. "We do have posted up at the door that entry is at the discretion of management. We don't have a written down ?couples only' because that depends on the night," she said.

MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
Nothing new here, this has been going on for years. If you're anything but Lebanese or Arab looking try getting into C Bar at the Al MArooj, it's virtually impossible.
Chocoholic
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May 27, 2006
Its funny coz i dont look "arab", and sometimes the bouncer would be about to not let me in, and then i start speaking in Arabic and i find the door wide open...

Last thursday i was in line to get in to a club, there was a european couple ifront of me and the bouncer was telling them its reservations only. He looks at me and goes "Do you have a reservation sir? " i didnt have one, then follows it in arabic asking me to say yes. so said yes, he looked at the european couple and told them see i am sorry guys !! i felt bad and asked him why he wasnt letting them in although its a couple. he told me he doesnt want to spoil the "ambience" .. :S
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
There is tons of racism at clubs here and it is BS, this is one of my biggest pet peeves in Dubai.
fayz
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May 27, 2006
Yep it's crap. But don't blame the doormen. It's management policy.
Chocoholic
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May 27, 2006
u said Maaad at one point, that some used the excuse of preventing men from becoming violent, they don t let single women in. do u men think of urselves or being apes or smthing without any shread or selfcontroll?
the other says that only couples r allowed. i cannot believ this hypocracy!!!! i read on many many sites that there r a lot more men in the uae, than women... :shock: is it me or this just doesnt make sense. i mean, ok, only couples, but than lets bring homos.e.xuality to fashion. i mean u poor baby boys, many of u only have the chance to date ur own kind.
this racism thing :evil: i already feel the blood boyling in me!! if only 20% of the population is local and if possible the work for the government, who the hell runs clubs, pubs, etc? expats, isn t it? now, why would u not let in ppl from india? white money is better than black money or what?
how is possible to see this kind of shity mentality in a place that is all about turism?
and finally, it makes me :pukeright: to see and read everywhere how we need to keep men from being violent, cover up women to give them respect, bark about how arab women r raped by americans, etc. u don t give a shit about us! wherever smthing happens or smthing is banned to do, or a situation needs to be fixed, etc, its always women who get hurt.

now whoever read one post of mine, know im pro-arab, and always against the racism that whites did and do all the time and all over. but i have to say this, u r not better than us.

i know many of u who will read this r just as much adainst this kind of mentality than i am, but unfortunately, trashy ppl u find a lot easier and a lot more
raidah
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May 27, 2006
agree with most of your points raidah, and racism is sick regardless of what race is involved.

But just wanted to clear up something, i didnt say any of this, it was in the daily newspaper here.
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
MaaaD wrote:agree with most of your points raidah, and racism is sick regardless of what race is involved.

But just wanted to clear up something, i didnt say any of this, it was in the daily newspaper here.


i know, that is why i said this:"u said Maaad at one point, that some used the excuse..."
sorry if i wasn t clear, its obvious u don t aggree, othervice u would have not post this
raidah
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May 27, 2006
Chick, you'd be surrpised to hear that many bar and clubs managers are actually Indian or Asian and so are actually descriminating against their own.

Many venues won't actually say 'couples policy' but will let a group of girls then a group of guys, the aim is to get an even mix of guys and girls inside. If they let everyone in it would be over run with guys, guaranteed.

Plus they don't want more guys hassling the women.

Also many people will tell you the reasoning behind favouring certain nationalities is they think that western expats spend more money on a night out. Remember the sole aim of these venues is to make money. Brits, Aussies, SA's, Yanks etc are BIG drinkers, they put money behind the bar, which is exactly what bars want, whereas you might have a group of guys of another nationality, who share a bottle of water between 5 of them all night and just stand and gorp at the girls on the dance floor. So if you were running the business what makes more provitable sense to you? But things are changing, I mean people of all nationalities are making money now and these places have to realise that.

I know alot about this, as I know many of the managers, door staff and DJ's working in this city and have written about the subject extensively in my articles.
Chocoholic
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May 27, 2006
raidah wrote:
MaaaD wrote:agree with most of your points raidah, and racism is sick regardless of what race is involved.

But just wanted to clear up something, i didnt say any of this, it was in the daily newspaper here.


i know, that is why i said this:"u said Maaad at one point, that some used the excuse..."
sorry if i wasn t clear, its obvious u don t aggree, othervice u would have not post this


nothing to be sorry about, after your thong link today you are my favourite DFer for the day ;)
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
Most of the time it has to do with what one wears. Not to generalize, but I have seen some Indians get turned away exactly because of this reason.
A64Venice
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May 27, 2006
Chocoholic wrote:Chick, you'd be surrpised to hear that many bar and clubs managers are actually Indian or Asian and so are actually descriminating against their own.

Many venues won't actually say 'couples policy' but will let a group of girls then a group of guys, the aim is to get an even mix of guys and girls inside. If they let everyone in it would be over run with guys, guaranteed.

Plus they don't want more guys hassling the women.

Also many people will tell you the reasoning behind favouring certain nationalities is they think that western expats spend more money on a night out. Remember the sole aim of these venues is to make money. Brits, Aussies, SA's, Yanks etc are BIG drinkers, they put money behind the bar, which is exactly what bars want, whereas you might have a group of guys of another nationality, who share a bottle of water between 5 of them all night and just stand and gorp at the girls on the dance floor. So if you were running the business what makes more provitable sense to you? But things are changing, I mean people of all nationalities are making money now and these places have to realise that.

I know alot about this, as I know many of the managers, door staff and DJ's working in this city and have written about the subject extensively in my articles.


chick? me? :oops: oh thank you thank you :wink:

im againts stupidity of any kind and no matter who or where it comes from
it happened to me too in budapest tobe stoped at the entrance of a club because of the man i was with and having to watch how they searched him...
raidah
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May 27, 2006
MaaaD wrote:
raidah wrote:
MaaaD wrote:agree with most of your points raidah, and racism is sick regardless of what race is involved.

But just wanted to clear up something, i didnt say any of this, it was in the daily newspaper here.


i know, that is why i said this:"u said Maaad at one point, that some used the excuse..."
sorry if i wasn t clear, its obvious u don t aggree, othervice u would have not post this


nothing to be sorry about, after your thong link today you are my favourite DFer for the day ;)


:oops:
is there anything else i could help u with?

:lol:
raidah
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May 27, 2006
raidah wrote:
MaaaD wrote:
raidah wrote:
MaaaD wrote:agree with most of your points raidah, and racism is sick regardless of what race is involved.

But just wanted to clear up something, i didnt say any of this, it was in the daily newspaper here.


i know, that is why i said this:"u said Maaad at one point, that some used the excuse..."
sorry if i wasn t clear, its obvious u don t aggree, othervice u would have not post this


nothing to be sorry about, after your thong link today you are my favourite DFer for the day ;)




:oops:
is there anything else i could help u with?

:lol:


hmm now that you mention it lets take it offline and see what you have on offer :P
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
nothing to be sorry about, after your thong link today you are my favourite DFer for the day ;)[/quote]



:oops:
is there anything else i could help u with?

:lol:[/quote]

hmm now that you mention it lets take it offline and see what you have on offer :P[/quote]

im not sure im following u :tweety:
raidah
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May 27, 2006
raidah wrote:


:oops:
is there anything else i could help u with?

:lol:

hmm now that you mention it lets take it offline and see what you have on offer :P

im not sure im following u :tweety:


you dont have to follow me, i will lead :P
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
bad idea hun, nobody leads me 8)
raidah
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May 27, 2006
thats what you all say in the begining ..............
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
beginning of what? :roll:
raidah
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May 27, 2006
a romp in the backseat of my car
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
is that a marriage proposal? :oops:
need to take my pills, can t handle this much stress
raidah
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May 27, 2006
fayz wrote:There is tons of racism at clubs here and it is BS, this is one of my biggest pet peeves in Dubai.


I don't think this one was one of the "pet peeves" previously mentioned in the pet peeve thread (it would be either 19 or 20)
Concord
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May 27, 2006
raidah wrote:is that a marriage proposal? :oops:
need to take my pills, can t handle this much stress


absolutely not !!! who do you think i am ? HP ? :P
MaaaD
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May 27, 2006
Maaad

Behave ,you naughty boy.

:wink: :wink: :wink:
arniegang
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May 27, 2006
arniegang wrote:Maaad

Behave ,you naughty boy.

:wink: :wink: :wink:


he was noughty? :shock:
i need to be more around hiya. maybe she could give some good advice on how to read men... :roll:
raidah
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May 27, 2006
Maaad is like a dog on heat today!! :lol:
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May 28, 2006
I was thinking that, it is so unlike Maaad
arniegang
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May 28, 2006
Its nice to see Maaad is joining the naughty boys! Arnie...looks like we have some competition at last! Just don't you let him get near Vee or Alex! Sic 'im!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

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May 28, 2006
Is this supposed to be news??? :shock:
Liban
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May 28, 2006
maybe that's one of reasons i don't like going clubs in Dubai.
I never go any clubs and bars alone in Dubai. coz it might be not fun to be there if you are alone :) .
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