Allah - Malaysia Ruling

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Allah - Malaysia ruling Dec 31, 2009
This was a weird case - where the Malaysian government tried to ban non-Muslims referring to God as Allah. This is bizzare, because it is a new development by some Islamphobic Christians to argue that 'Allah' is not God of the Bible (Yahweh/Jehova/God).

Its doubly bizzare because Arab Christians all pray to Allah and use Allah in their services (IIRC the first authorised mass in a language other than Latin was when the Vatican allowed Arab Catholics to use Arabic in their liturgy/mass etc - and they refer to Allah).

Anyway - the Malaysian courts have seen sense and ruled sensibly (but who knows, when Mad Mullah's get an idea they usually are obsessive about it!):

Malaysian court rules non-Muslims may call God Allah

Religious freedom is guaranteed by law in Malaysia

A court in Malaysia has ruled that Christians have a constitutional right to use the world Allah when referring to God.

The High Court said a government ban on non-Muslims using the word was unconstitutional.

The court was ruling on a lawsuit filed by the Herald, a publication of the Catholic Church in Malaysia, in 2007.

The authorities had insisted that Allah was an Islamic word which could only be used by Muslims.
The BBC's Jennifer Pak in Kuala Lumpur said some Muslim groups suspect the Catholic Church is seeking to encourage Muslims to convert to Christianity - a move which is illegal in Malaysia.
'Glorious new year'
The issue had become a symbol of a growing number of religious grievances among minority groups, in a political environment often divided along racial and religious lines, our correspondent adds.
The Herald filed for a judicial review after it was temporarily ordered to stop publishing in 2007 for referring to "Allah".
The publication said it had been been using the word for decades, and had a constitutional right to do so.
The Herald welcomed Thursday's ruling, saying it would be a "glorious new year for some 850,000 Catholics in Malaysia".
More than half of Malaysia's population is Muslim but the large Chinese and Indian communities are mainly Christian, Buddhist or Hindu.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8435975.stm

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Shafique

shafique
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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 10, 2010
Seems that Malay Muslim donot take it so well:

Firebombs were thrown at three more churches in Malaysia on Sunday and another was splashed with black paint, the latest in a series of assaults on Christian houses of worship following a court decision allowing non-Muslims to use "Allah" to refer to God.


4 more churches attacked in Malaysia in Allah feud
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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 11, 2010
Sometimes I am a beliver that after storm comes sunshine!. Following comments seems more like what’s behind such rows aginst christian Allah in Malaysia…

I have read the comments and I think I have a duty to explain what happened there to all. 1) In arab countries Allah may also be used as common for all religion god becase that is the language. But in Malaysia, the common word is "tuhan" or "god" and all are allowed to use it. Tuhan for Muslim in Malaysia has always been Allah while Tuhan for Christian (jesus), Tuhan for hindu(harirama, hari krishna- I don't know much) and more for other religions there. 2) Most muslims in Malaysia are born muslim, even though they are not really practicing (prostitutes or drug addicts etc), they still stick to being muslim despite their sin. 3) Charistians in Malaysia has been actively trying to convert these muslims who are not very knowledgeable in Islam to christian, but being born Muslim as I said, they only believe in Allah, despite their sin. If you say other than "tuhan" Allah, they will not follow. Some chinese always say "tuhan ALLAH" when they speak, referring to Muslim's god. 4) So to make the conversion easier, christian come out with the idea using the word Allah, so that these "lack of knowledge in Islam" people will be tricked and convert. 5) To do that is not easy, so they applied to Malaysian Court and the case was handled by non-muslim judge who will not understand Islam definitely. So he allowed it. The reason is that it is being used in Arab countries. 6) As I said earlier, Arab countries are using their language as common god, but not in Malaysia as I already exlpained. 7) someone said it is used in Indonesia, Maybe it was through the same trick they are doing now in Malaysia, I don't know. But in Malaysia it is not yet and they are still trying. 8] That is why the muslim there is protesting. I hope this will clarify the situation.



The problem is Malays for centuries never come across of non-muslims in their country using word "Allah" for their god or gods. When non-muslims want to use it they feel like their God's name been hijacked or misused. All they know "Allah" is the one true God whereas Christians believe Jesus is God (also son of God), God has son, God died on the cross, God has human's attributes etc. Malay Muslims since their childhood were taught God is One (not 3 in 1), Eternel (not died on the cross), He begets not nor is He begotten (has no son nor He is son of anyone) and they believe there is nothing like God. They believe Jesus as one of Allah's prophet not that Jesus is Allah or son of Allah. So they feel insulted when other religions want to use "Allah" and gave Allah attributes those do not fit Him. They couldn't accept Allah's honor abused in Church with inappropriate attributes. I personaly do not agree with the Malays' protest but at the same time felt that Church should respect Muslims in Malaysia to honor their Lord the way they wish without being disturbed since centuries ago.


http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Sate ... /NWELayout

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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 11, 2010
With all due respect Berrin, the explanation is laughable - if there are weak faithed Muslims in Malay that will be converted to Christianity because of the term 'Allah', then the solution is not to ban Christians etc from using Allah, but to educate the stupid ones.

Sheesh.

At least the Muslim authorities there are denouncing the violence.

Cheers,
Shafique
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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 11, 2010
:wink: :D
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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 12, 2010
2) Most muslims in Malaysia are born muslim, even though they are not really practicing (prostitutes or drug addicts etc), they still stick to being muslim despite their sin. 3) Charistians in Malaysia has been actively trying to convert these muslims who are not very knowledgeable in Islam to christian, but being born Muslim as I said, they only believe in Allah, despite their sin. If you say other than "tuhan" Allah, they will not follow. Some chinese always say "tuhan ALLAH" when they speak, referring to Muslim's god. 4) So to make the conversion easier, christian come out with the idea using the word Allah, so that these "lack of knowledge in Islam" people will be tricked and convert.


I have to side with berrin on this issue. The explanation is totally correct and logical - Muslims who are prostitutes or drug dealers are infinitely better than Muslims who become apostates and convert to Christianity.

The Koran is quite clear that Muslims who turn on their faith and die as unbelievers/disbelievers will be tortured in the fires of hell forever, along with all other unbelievers who heard the message of Islam but did not convert.

On the other hand, while a Muslim drug dealer or murderer (of fellow Muslims) is a sinner, his torture in the grave and residence in hell will be only temporary (unless he becomes a suicide bomber and dies for Islam, as per 9:111 of the Koran).

To me, the matter is clear. If prohibiting Christian missionaries from using 'Allah' helps to prevent Muslims from becoming apostates and dieing in unbelief, then the Malaysian government, which is run partly on Islamic Law, should do everything in its power from allowing Christians to use the word 'Allah' to refer to their God.
event horizon
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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 12, 2010
shafique wrote:With all due respect Berrin, the explanation is laughable - if there are weak faithed Muslims in Malay that will be converted to Christianity because of the term 'Allah', then the solution is not to ban Christians etc from using Allah, but to educate the stupid ones.

Sheesh.

At least the Muslim authorities there are denouncing the violence.

Cheers,
Shafique


That's a good point too - a Muslim majority country should spend tax dollars on 'educating' Muslims in their faith so as to prevent them from converting to another faith. I wonder the uproar that would stir if that was proposed in a Western nation?

But never-mind. I personally would think a fusion of both plans would be the best way to combat Christian missionary activity - which is illegal under Islamic law in any event.
event horizon
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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 12, 2010
event horizon wrote:
shafique wrote:With all due respect Berrin, the explanation is laughable - if there are weak faithed Muslims in Malay that will be converted to Christianity because of the term 'Allah', then the solution is not to ban Christians etc from using Allah, but to educate the stupid ones.

Sheesh.

At least the Muslim authorities there are denouncing the violence.

Cheers,
Shafique


That's a good point too - a Muslim majority country should spend tax dollars on 'educating' Muslims in their faith so as to prevent them from converting to another faith. I wonder the uproar that would stir if that was proposed in a Western nation?

But never-mind. I personally would think a fusion of both plans would be the best way to combat Christian missionary activity - which is illegal under Islamic law in any event.


shafique - did you miss the question?
event horizon
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Re: Allah - Malaysia ruling Jan 13, 2010
I couldn't see a question - other than the one about spending state money on educating people about the main religion.

I personally went to state-sponsored religious education classes and learnt about the Bible and Christianity - nothing wrong with that at all. This was in the UK - and today all school children are taught religious education and learn about Christianity and also about the other religions too.

So, I'm totally in favour of more religious education.

Therefore I agree with you.

Islamic countries too should do the same - as we've seen, historically Islamic rulers have been very tolerant of other religious orders - but some medieval minded mullahs are taking the retrograde step and are feeling very insecure. God is pretty clear in the Quran - 'there is no compulsion in religion' and Islam can stand quite close scrutiny and comparison with other religions, there's nothing to be feared from learning/teaching of all other religions.

So - I agree with you.

Was there another question you intended?

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Shafique
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