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Fair play to them

If you got it - buy it and flaunt it i say

Exactly

desertdudeshj wrote:You do know that GTR belongs to the crown prince of Dubai Shk Hamdan right.

Worried about the fine, your right I think not. I was actually wondering if the fine was paid at all.

I'm not that familiar with clampers, but I didn't think they answered to anyone, not even Fazza.
They probably do quite well for themselves during this time of the year.

arniegang wrote:Fair play to them

If you got it - buy it and flaunt it i say

Nope...I do not agree!!!

Not just because you got it, it's OK to do anything with it.

Legally, yes, you can spend it anyway you want, but morally, it is not right to spend millions foolishly on something as petty as a mere piece of metal (a stupid license plate) when, instead, those millions could be spent to help the poor, the sick and the hungry.

Throwing lots of millions on a thin, small piece of metal that costs pennies to produce is morally obscene in my opinion.

With vast wealth also comes social responsibility.

Bill Gates is richer, many times over, than those foolish Gulf Arabs, yet he eats at McDonald’s, travels business class (not first,) and gives billions (with a B) to charity.


End of sermon!!

TJ - I'm with you when it comes to the morality and responsibility of spending money.

However, the actions of those who are filthy rich is nothing new. Throughout history when wealth is accumulated disproportionately, the inheritors of that wealth - especially the first few generations - give themselves over to conspicuous spending and follies - rare is the nouveau rich in history who does not buy the bling of their time.

History shows that the older monied classes, throughout the years, look down on the nouveau rich and forget that their forebears also blinged out - only over time the money runs out, or the cost of servicing the mansions, stately homes, castles, empires means that they don't have the wealth of the newcomers and they hide behind a snobbishness about how 'vulgar' the new guys are.

Interestingly, in societies where there isn't this great disparity between the richest and the poorest - take Ancient Sparta as an example - you don't get this issue -rather society as a whole rises and falls. Athenians got relatively more rich than other city states - and they blinged out on statues, temples, marathons, orgies etc etc. I'm sure there were the 'tut tuts' going on by those who thought this vulgar.

Philanthropists like Gates etc aren't new. In modern times you have guys who blinged out and also spent on charities - from Rockefeller, Carnegie etc. You have others who are more austere - such as the Rowntrees and the Buffets.

What you find is that those making the money doing actual work, don't have the inclination or time to do too much of the conspicuous bling. It is the next generation that gets the wealth without sweat that splurges out conspicously, and then it takes a few more generations before they become accustomed to the money and how to live with it (if there is any left by then) - then you'll find the trust funds, charitable foundations etc - and yet they are still living the lavish lifestyle their wealth allows, but not in front of the hoi polloi!


Also, when we look at the comments in the thread - it mirrors the observation that criticism is levelled against those who conspicuously spend the wealth. Had $14m been spent on a expensive wine for a small exclusive dinner party - that would be (I could argue) as stupid/obscene/irresponsible as spending 0.00000001% of his wealth on a vanity number plate.

Russian Billionaires are the current fashionable ones for people to look down their noses at - but they have quickly bought themselves into the rich societies and will quickly integrate and then will look down their noses at the next wave of Billionaires.

At the end of the day, it's nothing new - spoilt rich kids have supported many a luxury brand from the jewellery makers of Ancient Egypt to Bugatti.

When there is conspicuous consumption of disproportionate wealth, there will always be those who look from above and below and swear that the grapes are sour!

Cheers,
Shafique

Tom Jones wrote:
Not just because you got it, it's OK to do anything with it.

Legally, yes, you can spend it anyway you want, but morally, it is not right to spend millions foolishly on something as petty as a mere piece of metal (a stupid license plate) when, instead, those millions could be spent to help the poor, the sick and the hungry.

Dotn worry TJ, its alla bout taste and individual class.

Give each DF member a billion dirhams, some will spend 50 million of it in cars (myself), others will spend 200 million of it in gold pens/sunglasses/basins and feel proud of doing so, something that I will never do simply because my taste is otherwise.

There are tasteful ways to waste your billions.

Charles Saatchi has spent his on art and funding up and coming contemporary artists, much the same as Guggenheim did, the difference being he tends to keep his collection for his own appreciation rather than building interesting edifices in which to display them. Maybe he will one day?

I have met 'old monied' types who look like they struggle to rub two brass fils together in tatty old clothes and driving old bangers. A certain toothsome British entrepreneur and airline magnate of my acquaintance travels around London to meetings on the back of a motorcycle rather than take taxis or a limo. He claims only to own 5 pairs of shoes! He never has a bean in his pocket despite raising and donating over 25 million pounds a year to charities. He does own a car, its a 10 year old Range Rover but hardly ever leaves the garage.



Knight

Wow cool car

Branson and Gates came from reasonably well off homes - both have parents who are/were successful lawyers. Arguably they learnt what was the 'done thing' when it came to money?

The peculiar form of snobbery of the monied Anglo-Saxon classes is a fascinating phenomenon. I used to go game shooting when in the UK and had a small insight into this part of UK life. It's compulsory to have battered cars, wear distressed Barbour jackets etc - and still have shot guns which cost more than the average house in the UK!

Interestingly, the wiki entry for 'parvenu' lists the former Shah of Iran as a parvenu - and contains a line relevant to this thread:

Several examples might include athletic and entertainment professionals born and raised in poverty and suddenly finding themselves with significantly higher sources of income due to their new-found celebrity status. The established old money factions of society often choose to exclude these individuals from their ranks, with the argument that such people are tasteless in their spending and use their wealth to flaunt their economic standing rather than practice philanthropy, maintain discretion, and otherwise acquiesce to the accepted behavior of the social class.

The Bonaparte family were considered parvenu royalty by other royal families of Europe. Napoleon III tried to marry into Swedish and German royalty, but was unsuccessful due to his status as parvenu. This was also said to be the case with the marriage of Egyptian Princess Fawzia to the future Shah of Iran, Mohammad Reza Pahlavi. One of the reasons speculated for their divorce is that Fawzia’s family, including King Farouk I, viewed the Pahlavis as parvenus. Though the Muhammad Ali Dynasty of Egypt and Sudan, to which Fawzia belonged, had humble beginnings, it had solidified its status in Egypt and the Arab World since 1805. In contrast, the Pahlavis were a far more recent dynasty, owing their position entirely to the coup d’etat of Mohammad Reza Pahlavi’s father, Reza Khan, in 1921.

Other examples may have worked their way up the ladder, originally poor immigrants to the United States. Originally immigrant workers, they would have found themselves able to take advantage of the growing opportunities in the U.S., moving on to become civil servants, “white collar” (business/office) workers and finally a member of the respectable society. Such an example might be John Jacob Astor, whose family once skinned rabbits for a living[citation needed] and went on to build such icons of New York City as the Waldorf-Astoria Hotel with his brother. Many believe this phenomenon is not as common in Europe due to the centuries-old, well-established social hierarchy of European countries, nor is it as common in present-day U.S. due to largely the same reasons.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parvenu


Cheers,
Shafique

Almost everyone flaunts their wealth to a certain degree. Whether its a nice car, a nice house, an expensive holiday somewhere, donating money to charity or investing in arts... impressing other people is high on the objectives.
Although some flaunt it more than others, which seems to be the problem.
A property millionare I know got cancer, but was cured. He did the right thing and donated several million dollars to build a new wing of the hospital dedicated to cancer treatment.
The only problem I had was that he named the new wing after himself and then proceeded to put billboards up around town annoucning his donation.

If I was rich I would put enough money back into my business or businesses to try to sustain a good income, while donating as much as possible to different charitable causes. I just can't imagine even living in a way that I would consider myself only worthy of $200 t-shirts, and $5000 handbags instead of perfectly nice $20 t-shirts and $50 handbags. I wonder what it would take to make some of these rich people decide that they can spend less on frivolity and more on helping others.

I am with you on that one K.

I think if I were a gozillionaire, I would be like Forrest Gump. I would still shop in Karama and Satwa and drive something sensible. Admittedly it might be a little newer, but nothing ostentatious.

The idea of being idle rich really does not appeal apart from having the time to do all the things I would like to do for myself and others. I would have to work at something...or go mad. Not that I am sane now...



Knight

shafique wrote:TJ - I'm with you when it comes to the morality and responsibility of spending money.

However, the actions of those who are filthy rich is nothing new. Throughout history when wealth is accumulated disproportionately, the inheritors of that wealth - especially the first few generations - give themselves over to conspicuous spending and follies - rare is the nouveau rich in history who does not buy the bling of their time.

History shows that the older monied classes, throughout the years, look down on the nouveau rich and forget that their forebears also blinged out - only over time the money runs out, or the cost of servicing the mansions, stately homes, castles, empires means that they don't have the wealth of the newcomers and they hide behind a snobbishness about how 'vulgar' the new guys are.

Interestingly, in societies where there isn't this great disparity between the richest and the poorest - take Ancient Sparta as an example - you don't get this issue -rather society as a whole rises and falls. Athenians got relatively more rich than other city states - and they blinged out on statues, temples, marathons, orgies etc etc. I'm sure there were the 'tut tuts' going on by those who thought this vulgar.

Philanthropists like Gates etc aren't new. In modern times you have guys who blinged out and also spent on charities - from Rockefeller, Carnegie etc. You have others who are more austere - such as the Rowntrees and the Buffets.

What you find is that those making the money doing actual work, don't have the inclination or time to do too much of the conspicuous bling. It is the next generation that gets the wealth without sweat that splurges out conspicously, and then it takes a few more generations before they become accustomed to the money and how to live with it (if there is any left by then) - then you'll find the trust funds, charitable foundations etc - and yet they are still living the lavish lifestyle their wealth allows, but not in front of the hoi polloi!


Also, when we look at the comments in the thread - it mirrors the observation that criticism is levelled against those who conspicuously spend the wealth. Had $14m been spent on a expensive wine for a small exclusive dinner party - that would be (I could argue) as stupid/obscene/irresponsible as spending 0.00000001% of his wealth on a vanity number plate.

Russian Billionaires are the current fashionable ones for people to look down their noses at - but they have quickly bought themselves into the rich societies and will quickly integrate and then will look down their noses at the next wave of Billionaires.

At the end of the day, it's nothing new - spoilt rich kids have supported many a luxury brand from the jewellery makers of Ancient Egypt to Bugatti.

When there is conspicuous consumption of disproportionate wealth, there will always be those who look from above and below and swear that the grapes are sour!

Cheers,
Shafique

Shafique,

You present a good argument esp. about the nouveau rich and the young generation who don't know the value of money, because it was handed to them on a silver platter.

However, I do not agree with your last statement regarding the sour grapes.

I am not jealous of those who spend their money foolishly and extravagantly. Not at all. I could care less how easily they got their money, but I object to the millions they spend on trivial and insignificant things, just for vanity. I think that's morally wrong and obscene knowing there are thousands, if not millions, of suffering children and adults all over the world who could be saved and helped with that money.

Cheers!

Tom Jones wrote:
You present a good argument esp. about the nouveau rich and the young generation who don't know the value of money, because it was handed to them on a silver platter.

However, I do not agree with your last statement regarding the sour grapes.

I am not jealous of those who spend their money foolishly and extravagantly. Not at all. I could care less how easily they got their money, but I object to the millions they spend on trivial and insignificant things, just for vanity. I think that's morally wrong and obscene knowing there are thousands, if not millions, of suffering children and adults all over the world who could be saved and helped with that money.

Cheers!

Enough with this argument already!!! The poor don't want charity, they want Trade!
And in capitalistic societies the more people spend the smoother the wheels turn, the smoother the wheels turn, the less stay poor.

I'm not denying everyone ought to do a bit of charity, but beyond that, live and let live! If I've made a billion bucks fair and square, why should I unduly burden myself with poverty elsewhere?
Off-course obscene shows of wealth and grandeur are tasteless but this "guilt trip" mongering by the 'virtuous' is simply retarded!

Misery Called Life wrote:

Tom Jones wrote:
You present a good argument esp. about the nouveau rich and the young generation who don't know the value of money, because it was handed to them on a silver platter.

However, I do not agree with your last statement regarding the sour grapes.

I am not jealous of those who spend their money foolishly and extravagantly. Not at all. I could care less how easily they got their money, but I object to the millions they spend on trivial and insignificant things, just for vanity. I think that's morally wrong and obscene knowing there are thousands, if not millions, of suffering children and adults all over the world who could be saved and helped with that money.

Cheers!

Enough with this argument already!!! The poor don't want charity, they want Trade!
And in capitalistic societies the more people spend the smoother the wheels turn, the smoother the wheels turn, the less stay poor.

I'm not denying everyone ought to do a bit of charity, but beyond that, live and let live! If I've made a billion bucks fair and square, why should I unduly burden myself with poverty elsewhere?
Off-course obscene shows of wealth and grandeur are tasteless but this "guilt trip" mongering by the 'virtuous' is simply retarded!

What's this world coming to?????

Now caring for your fellow misfortune human beings is considered retarded!!!

How sad!!!!!!

benwj wrote:

desertdudeshj wrote:You do know that GTR belongs to the crown prince of Dubai Shk Hamdan right.

Worried about the fine, your right I think not. I was actually wondering if the fine was paid at all.

I'm not that familiar with clampers, but I didn't think they answered to anyone, not even Fazza.
They probably do quite well for themselves during this time of the year.

Plz if you can explain this Fazza thing to me...Heard about it alot but never knows the story behind it..

Tom Jones wrote:

Misery Called Life wrote:

Tom Jones wrote:
You present a good argument esp. about the nouveau rich and the young generation who don't know the value of money, because it was handed to them on a silver platter.

However, I do not agree with your last statement regarding the sour grapes.

I am not jealous of those who spend their money foolishly and extravagantly. Not at all. I could care less how easily they got their money, but I object to the millions they spend on trivial and insignificant things, just for vanity. I think that's morally wrong and obscene knowing there are thousands, if not millions, of suffering children and adults all over the world who could be saved and helped with that money.

Cheers!

Enough with this argument already!!! The poor don't want charity, they want Trade!
And in capitalistic societies the more people spend the smoother the wheels turn, the smoother the wheels turn, the less stay poor.

I'm not denying everyone ought to do a bit of charity, but beyond that, live and let live! If I've made a billion bucks fair and square, why should I unduly burden myself with poverty elsewhere?
Off-course obscene shows of wealth and grandeur are tasteless but this "guilt trip" mongering by the 'virtuous' is simply retarded!

What's this world coming to?????

Now caring for your fellow misfortune human beings is considered retarded!!!

How sad!!!!!!

No man don't be shocked, caring an all that jazz is great but this constant guilt trip mongering is not! People may live the way they want too, don't bring starving kids and widows and whatnot into the equation. That's all!!

Yeah, it is inconvenient for some rich folk to feel those little pangs of guilt about poor people. All they have to do is go and buy a $4000 pair of shoes to feel better and take their minds off of it.

now i am feeling guilty and there's me with my new DB9 and a 2 little piece of plastic with 5 digits that cost more than the average car in the UK.

Well Actually ...............................


NO I'm not - i love it.

does this face look bothered ??

arniegang wrote:now i am feeling guilty and there's me with my new DB9 and a 2 little piece of plastic with 5 digits that cost more than the average car in the UK.

Well Actually ...............................


NO I'm not - i love it.

does this face look bothered ??

Well, you could donate a nice chunk of money to a charity of choice to balance it out

arniegang wrote:now i am feeling guilty and there's me with my new DB9 and a 2 little piece of plastic with 5 digits that cost more than the average car in the UK.

Well Actually ...............................


NO I'm not - i love it.

does this face look bothered ??

whats the 5 digits?

benwj wrote:

arniegang wrote:now i am feeling guilty and there's me with my new DB9 and a 2 little piece of plastic with 5 digits that cost more than the average car in the UK.

Well Actually ...............................


NO I'm not - i love it.

does this face look bothered ??

whats the 5 digits?

it spells out my name so sadly i wont be able to post on here

So you managed to get ARN 1 E?

A mate of mine in the US has the Florida plate 'Bollocks' on his mammoth chrome mountain...the septics just don't get it at all!



Knight

Dubai Knight wrote:So you managed to get ARN 1 E?

A mate of mine in the US has the Florida plate 'Bollocks' on his mammoth chrome mountain...the septics just don't get it at all!



Knight

you buuger, you actually arn't that far out

the only reason i am not posting the plate number here is that its really easy to trace a UK home address from a UK plate

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/5/20100729/tod-new-harrods-owners-fall-prey-to-clam-870a197.html

-- Fri Jul 30, 2010 4:14 pm --



-- Fri Jul 30, 2010 4:18 pm --

A Koenigsegg CCXR worth £1.2m and a Lamborghini Murcielago worth £350,000 - both in the fetching colour of turquoise - were parked outside the Qatari's ruling family's latest acquisition when they were spotted by traffic wardens.

The cars were initially given tickets and then clamped, to the amazement of passers-by who gathered to watch.

The custom-made cars are part of the royal family's fleet of supercars.

The Qatari ruling family are behind the Qatar Holding Group which bought Harrods from Mohamed al Fayed in April for £1.5bn.

The business is led by the Qatari Prime Minister, Sheikh Hamad al Thani.

The al Thani family are worth around £2.5bn and have stakes in dozens of businesses around the world.

As well as their magnificent car collection, their assets include a fleet of multi-million pound yachts and luxury homes around the world.

so what are rich ppl suppose to drive ? Electric cars get real

one should be more concern about whom his country is spoiling with his tax money !
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/201 ... te-schools

Just because you have mega bucks, does not mean you HAVE to drive a suped up car!

You know if all these super rich people & celebs and whatnot each put a million dollars towards charity, so much could be done and it's not much skin off their nose, plus it's a tax rightoff too.

I have no problem with people who have 'earned' their money, but what sits uncomfortably is those who've done nothing to earn it or have earnt it off the blood, sweat and tears of others i.e. Sheiky boy running around in hs flash cars, while some poor workers are building his city, living in appalling conditions.

Terrible.

and what makes you think that those guys aren't paying their dues ?
Emirates for one are one of the most charity ppl around "not me" it comes with the religious and the culture.

the same poor workers build the city for you too choc after you ranaway form paying your country dues, so what did you do for them ?

If I recall, Chocs donates money and goods to charitable causes in Dubai.

Do you disagree with the point that the guy at the top could do without a second luxury 40,000 sq ft villa in another Emirate, or maybe a few less sports cars if it meant that the workers could live in comfortable, clean, air conditioned housing including enough nutritiously complete food and a decent salary?