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Do you have friends leaving?


Chocoholic I'm very sad at the moment, some of my very good friends have decided to leave Dubai and will be gone by the end of the year. This is the third wave of people I know leaving and it seems to be getting worse. The main reasons being that they've been made redundent and can't find other work, or have just had enough now. It's really started me thinking about how long I want to stay in Dubai myself, because at the moment I'm starting to consider it wasted time.
Mahmoud04 3 and counting. the issue here is i haven't make that much of friends, and started already to lose hope specially last few weeks. wasted time, thats what i hate about the truth, its really ugly. Chocoholic I do now feel that it's time being wasted, as it's pretty much same sh*t, different day. It's impossible for me to progress any further in this place or to find the things I'm looking for. Right now Asia is looking quite appealing. Searcaigh Several of my friends have left Dubai this year, a few years ago some left for Qatar but it is no different there. Several of my S. African friends returned to SA, citing better opportunities there and a better lifestyle. My current situation leaves me looking for a new job in order to get a pay rise, not so easy for somebody in their 50s. Fortunately I have a lot of experience in my own industry. Asia is good, but a lot of corruption in that part of the world too. Tom Jones
I understand….
I just got back recently after a long absence from Dubai, and indeed I found that some friends and acquaintances had already left town, either gone back home or to pursue other opportunities in other countries.
The strangest thing is that I haven’t really noticed any significant decrease in traffic, despite all the halted projects and the great number of redundancies we're hearing about!!!!
What’s going on???
8) 8) uaekid it's about time LOOOOOL anyway I thought ppl are finding jobs in AD wih all the projects going on or starting Tom Jones
It's about time what, kid??????????
Chocs leaving???
If she did, you would be bored, not having anyone to fight with!!!!! :) :)
8) 8) Mahmoud04 i am quite depressed these days actually.... its a matter of time, but time is all what we have. uaekid
LOL
no I mean all of you... just kidding
but like I said, isn't AD the nexy wave ? smoggie Not friends leaving as such but I know what you mean about wasting time here! The vibe of 3 or 4 years ago is long gone. Everybody I speak to is in the same mindset. It's always scary contemplating a big move especially when you have made a place your home!

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Tom Jones
Possibly…..
But I have not seen an exodus, as yet, from Dubai to AD.
I just hope AD keeps in mind what happened to Dubai, by not embarking on an unsustainable hasty growth!
8) 8) xty In the last few days, I've been going back and forth to immigration (and typing centers), and I notice there are still more (about 2/3rd) cancellations than new applications. expatwanabe
Surely life’s what you make it, sitting back and setting for the safe options and an easy life is such a waste.
But there are no guarantees that you’ll find greener grass on the other side.
Once in a lifetime opportunities are everywhere believe it on not, you just have to be aware and prepared to take a risk occasionally. Chocoholic Very true, but it's much much harder to progress in this place, because you cannot jump up the career ladder by changing companies as you could anywhere else, so you can get stuck. At the moment my weeks are all sort of melding together, basically same stuff, different day. When you've been here as long as I have, there really is nothing new to try to occupy myself, because I've done it all. I really can't see myself being here in a years time. Roadtester Kinda the nature of the beast, try to make your money out here before moving on to something else. The world is going through tough times at the moment, and kinda got to make teh most of it. What kind of skills have you got choc - is it something specialised? Did you have a plan, or just kinda let the wind take you? Sounds more like you got itchy feet? Flying Dutchman My friends in Dubai already left in the first wave. Now I am one of those pathetic loners who sit alone at the bar drinking beer while watching foottie. sage & onion
This is sad!!!! capsicum
Absolutely, I m moving to Hong Kong in 2 months, some of my friends have left this place for Malaysia. Tom Jones
Yeah… Dubai can become very monotonous and boring after a while, esp. when you begin to see that everyday is turning out to be no different than the previous day (same bull, different day!!!!)
On the other hand, it would be extremely hard to uproot yourself from a place that you’d been in for so many years, and to move to yet another unfamiliar environment. Let alone changing careers and dealing with different people and new challenges…!
But to someone who’s fairly young, and still single with no children, I’d say go for it!
Just make sure you prepare well for it, by doing your homework thoroughly, ... before taking the plunge!!!
8) 8)
Chocoholic Well you see my family left here last year after being in Dubai for 10 years, they now live in Australia, so that's a very real option for me, however there are other places I would love to live and work, but it's finding the right opportunities. I can very easily set myself up to run my own business, that's no big deal, got all the kit and can do it from anywhere in the world. gertrude
Funny.... that's something I'd say to someone thinking of moving to Dubai Jamal :cry: damnn , if all the fine ladies wantin to leave ... then im truly too begining to think whats the point of stayin here ... now u got me wantin to leave aswell... an aint no doubt bout it ... dubai has completely lost its vibe.... Jamal :cry: damnn , if all the fine ladies wantin to leave ... then im truly too begining to think whats the point of stayin here ... now u got me wantin to leave aswell... an aint no doubt bout it ... dubai has completely lost its vibe.... sage & onion
Yeah I can see where your coming from J, after all your even starting to repeat yourself :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: DubaiInformationSite unfortunately i don't think many people have that option. when you lose your job, your work visa expires. there is no other way to prolong your stay unless you have enough money to buy land, which very few are doing in my understanding. sad indeed...but necessary capsicum
not a question of having money, an expat cannot buy land... if you are not a temporary resident you can only buy a property (on top but not the land) with a 6 months visa. What idiot s gonna do that? Roadtester This year coming will be tougher, our company is doing ok this year but next year is the big worry. With the end of stimulus monies that countries have been pumping into economies. As capsicum says - you can't get full residency, so you can't really put roots down here. Unfortunatly expats are destined to have to move on. Misery Called Life
You need to explain urself mate...globally economies have been showing signs of recovery and as far as Dubai goes, the rules have always been the same, one could never get full residency here. That did'nt stop people from thronging here in hordes.....
They definately need to stimulate the domestic economy which could happen by default in the event of a global recovery.
As far as debt goes? Everyone's watching Nakheel very closely.....
As far as Dubai goes at this juncture, yes, consumer confidence is low. And they're gonna have to work on that. Nakheel cannot afford to miss their bond payments coming up, likewise a good word from Oprah may help as well...
I'm monitoring global indicators very closely sage & onion
Sorry incorrectly stated, when you purchase a villa in say Arabian Ranches you also get to own the land on which the villa is built, the deed is issued by Dubai Lands Department, it is 100% freehold. Chocoholic :cry: Now one of my very best friends has dropped the bomb she's leaving next week - so sad! gertrude
So many times Nationals told expats: "if you dont like it, leave! " well seems they do . Bora Bora Chocs, if so many of your friends are living, this is a crisis. Who are you going to get all your information from???? Tom Jones
Wow!.... Another one!!
I thought things were beginning to stabilize a bit -- not improve,.. just stabilize a bit. But I guess I was wrong!
Hey Chocs….It would be interesting to know this:
How many of your friends who have already left, have actually left only because they had had it with Dubai, NOT because they had become redundant at their workplace?
In percentage terms, if you prefer – half, more than half, or perhaps none???
8) 8) Misery Called Life A song for those saying goodbye? Chocoholic TJ, I'd have to say probably about 50/50 to be honest and there are a few more considering a move. Very funny Bora - NOT! My sources don't change, just maybe the contacts. expatwanabe To spin it 180deg’s, do you think the current climate is stopping folk coming across. I had to turn an offer down last month because it just wasn’t right for me. But still hope to land the right job by the end of the year. But all the talk about redundancies may well put people off. There’s quite a lot of risk in upping sticks, moving to the other side of the world and then living with the fear of it all going pear shaped three months later. uaekid
don't give them hope man Chocoholic Yeah I think many people are being put off coming to the UAE. dubaidog I think we are going to pull the pin in the coming year. I'd go sooner, but the Mrs. has obligations for a few months. I am employed, but just had enough. None of my friends have left, but all my family will be gone in a couple of months. Dubai has been an experience, and perhaps the fastest years of my life (2 years today). Looking forward to the day when we are leaving....I miss blue skies, rain and cheap(er) cost of living. rudeboy chocs, people will keep on coming to dubai and will keep on leaving dubai so am sure you will make new friends. it is hard time for all of us and I believe we could probably help each other. Who knows one of us could be selling products or services which could be beneficial for others! smoggie let's face it....Most of us (expats) were riding the wave of good salaries and a feeling of living in a progressive City.... That seems to be over for the time being. They need to re-invent themselves in order to attract a new generation of talent. Interesting: xty just remember one thing, it is much much harder for people who loose the job, have to leave the country, AND leave their friends here. so consider yourself lucky if you are still here and keeping your job. Bora Bora
The exception would be Abu Dhabi. It continues to thrive and got through the recession without even a hiccup. And where the recession did have an impact they made early corrections.
In all probability AD didn't and doesn't have the level of embezzling and corruption that has taken place in Dubai. They also don't madate that locals just graduating university be given executive positions such as CEO, and I believe there is very little nepotism, which I don't have an issue with as long as the incoming relative is qualified, or "friend" if that is the case.
AD still relies heavily on expats and many people who were made redundant, and those who were anticipating redundency, went over to AD.
As for the other emirates, I don't think there were that many expats going there in the first place. It's not as if RAK or Al Ain were growing even close to the same level as did Dubai, or Abu Dhabi for that matter. busa Yep i too will be moving from Dubai this year,but only to my weekend bolthole in RAK. sage & onion
Somehow I don't believe their has been no problems in Abu Dhabi, it's just not at the scale of Dubai. Lets all pray that it comes good though. Bora Bora
What problems AD had S&O were minimal. The corruption and embezzling that took place in Dubai had a profound affect when the recession hit. Alot of the money that was stolen or embezzled in Dubai was hidden in bank accounts under family member names or was transferred out of the country. In comparison, I would have to say that there is very, very little of that in AD. I am sure the penalties are considerably serious in AD if caught embezzling or stealing, more than just a slap on the hand. gertrude What problems AD had S&O were minimal. The corruption and embezzling that took place in Dubai had a profound affect when the recession hit. Alot of the money that was stolen or embezzled in Dubai was hidden in bank accounts under family member names or was transferred out of the country. In comparison, I would have to say that there is very, very little of that in AD. I am sure the penalties are considerably serious in AD if caught embezzling or stealing, more than just a slap on the hand.
So....this is where this is going...Dubai is going to hit the dust, and blame it on the expats. Bora Bora
So....this is where this is going...Dubai is going to hit the dust, and blame it on the expats.
It can go there if you take it there Gertrude. No where, absolutely no where, did I say that expats were responsible for the embezzling and corruption. If you read my post in the context it was meant, you would see that I was pointing out that expats were heading to AD. That came as a result of companies failing, redundancies and people anticipating being made redundant. Or haven't you noticed?
Dubai will not go to dust. It will come back, but maybe not as strong as it once was. The embezzling and corruption got way out of hand. Now that Dubai is financially strapped, I'm sure during the recovery corporate finances are going to be monitored closely. It's a live and learn situation. The ride has come to an end for many people, locals and expats. catalyst
At the end .. everyone have to go home .. :D gertrude Dubai will not go to dust. It will come back, but maybe not as strong as it once was. The embezzling and corruption got way out of hand. Now that Dubai is financially strapped, I'm sure during the recovery corporate finances are going to be monitored closely. It's a live and learn situation. The ride has come to an end for many people, locals and expats.
Hummmm... too easy to claim that Dubai was victim of embezzling getting out of hand. Sure it was senseless spending, bad choices, greed and huge managment mistakes, but from the rulers / nationals not the expats.
So far no expats have been proven to be guilty of embezzlement and I dont think any foreigners beleive any longer in these court cases where expats are being blamed for zillions dollars scams.
If Dubai does not come back the way it was, it will go to dust, it cannot come back half strong like you say, and forget the other half who invested money in all these projects that are now stopped. sage & onion
Are seriously saying that no expat has been involved in stealing from the UAE???
The name Trutch has been mentioned on this forum before and he is one of a long line of expats who have been caught and admitted to stealing from here. gertrude This thread is about people who leave Dubai, anyways ....I looked it up, I cannot find any info on Mr Trutch. Never heard of him. The info on DF is not relevant because it s not supported by any links. So if you have the link on the court case in the UK, please drop it here. Bora Bora
I'm a bit confused. What court case in the UK?
Gertrude, much of what has happened never reached the press or the media. That would only have done more damage to Dubai. It's sad that you think that Dubai will turn to dust.
I said that it won't come back as strong as it was, but it will come back, but it is going to take a huge correction in order for it to come back to a level that it will be a destination - tourism and/or business. To what level, I don't know. If I could tell you that, I wouldn't be sitting here on DF; I'd be off making money from my power to foresee the future!!! sage & onion
Is this good enough for you:
Bora Bora
Well that settles that!! Couldn't be any more clear. Misery Called Life
Guess who's back :D expatwanabe From my brief stay there back in September I can think of a lot worst locations to be “stuck in”. Good luck to all those who are thinking about leaving, I hope you find what you’re looking for. What ever life throws at you, remember there are no such things as good and bad experiences. It’s all about how you interpret them, life’s too short to have to live with fears and regrets. capsicum
Yes, and I know a lot of worst places too, difference is I know them before hand, in Dubai it's smoke and mirrors, you know it sucks when it s too late. gertrude
Corrections? it ll never happen.
Too many scary news already, why take the risk and be jailed for a kiss, wearing a bikini or for having pain killers or a beer. Let's face it, Dubai is as liberal as Saudi. Business? before trying to lure more investors start compensating those who lost their downpayments on the properties that will never be built. Blaming expats CEO's won't do the trick. Steve Trutch, yes he was convicted in the UK, but is an old case (1993), out of the context. immortal01 I have heard abt this group called Pink Slip being run on Twitter and Linked In..helping people made redundant find jobs. You may suggest your friends to check this out :) Cheers Imm xty
you mean this one ( )? this could be entertaining to distressed people ;)
anyway, i can't find what you're referring. sage & onion
New or old it was the principal, anyways you are surely one who needs to stay away from Dubai because you are obviously against the place. Bora Bora
Gertrude, is it safe to say that you don't live in Dubai, or the UAE for that matter, since you get your information from the news.
I have yet to hear about anyone being arrested for wearing a bikini, unless of course, they were walking around the mall in one, which in any case, would be totally inappropriate anywhere. Bikinis and swimsuits belong on a beach or at a pool.
As for people losing their downpayments on properties that will never be built, who exactly should compensate them? The developers who went belly-up because of corruption and embezzlement are responsible. There still exists developers who are building and investors will see their properties become a reality.
Who said that all those responsible for the financial problems were expat CEOs? There are many locals who have been arrested for embezzlement and corruption.
Don't compare Dubai to Saudi Arabia. I drive my own car in Dubai. Men and women work together, they are not segregated. I am Muslim, but it is not mandated that I cover myself. Dubai has done alot to accommodate Westerners, and in the process, local culture has been diluted.
As Sage suggested, you should stay away from Dubai. It definitely is not the place for you. gertrude
BB....I live in Dubai Marina and I did not read it in the news, in 2007 I bought a 2 bed appartment in sport city, %30 down, AED400,000. with delivery in 2008. They have not started anything yet. Last month I logged a complain at RERA, they do nothing, if I go to court, I have to surrender my passport, and if I dont pay the installments I ll go to jail. It s a scam, I am not the only one, there is nothing you can do, the justice system and the local media is biased, you can't win. It s a fraud endorsed by the authorities.
Yes I will stay away from Dubai, like hundreds of thousands more, and in the end when the truth comes out, Dubai will return to the dust.
Sage is only one of these guys to be happy to carry Emirati's luggage for free. I guess after this I ll be banned from DF too! Red Chief
It's very true statement. My friend "invested" a lot of money in the sand ("future flat') 3 years ago with "promise" to build it in 2 years but it hasn't even started yet.
With such confidence to contractor who will buy a flat on the initial stage of constraction? But witout money and limited credit resourses how contractor can finish a biulding or start new one. It's a closed circle.
In such condition recovery of real estate is hardly possible but it used to be the main driver of Dubai's economy. sage & onion
Say whatever you want, but stay away from Dubai, it's not for you. Bora Bora @gertrude. I am sorry to hear of your misfortune. I guess you are tied to Dubai merely for the fact that you have purchased something that doesn't exist. I'm sure there are a lot of expats who still stay in Dubai for the same reason. Gertrude, you bought into the dream, which became a nightmare for many. If not for the property, I guess you, and many others would have left. What I never got was how people ran out to buy "off plan". Why would someone buy something that actually doesn't exist? If you recall when the first few freehold properties went up for sale, people, the majority being locals as they had "inside" purchase advantages, were snatching up 10 to 20 "properties" and flipping them two days later at double the purchase price. The second buyer them flipped them within a matter of days for again double the price. All that flipping made people quite a pretty penny. It went on for sometime until the govt put a law in place requiring first time ownership for a certain period of time before selling. Most people who purchased did so as an investment. Who could ever dream of retiring in Dubai when you factor in "could you actually afford to retire in Dubai"? That could only be possible for people who have some serious money. I doubt the "average" person, or middle class person, could survive very long living in retirement here. I can see why you are bitter, but you did take a gamble - you bought something that did not exist. Its like playing cards, you bet against the hand that you can't see. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. gertrude BB, in the West, selling something that does not exist is called a fraud. In Dubai it is endorsed and investors have 2 choices, stay away and be quiet as Sage recommends, or protest and go to jail. And if it was gambling, since when is it allowed in one of the most strict muslim country? As the words are getting out, I doubt much investors will put their money in Dubai. Also there is a severe deception here, it is not possible to retire in Dubai, whether you have money or not. Temporary residency is allowed either under a work visa, 60 years old max, or 6 mo / year for real estate owners. In my contract, residency was offered, but the law changed after I signed..... Bora Bora
I used gambling as an anology Gertrude. So if buying wasn't for retirement, then it was for profit. A lot of people made money, and a lot of people lost money. Fortunately I don't sit on either side of the fence.
I am from the US Gertrude and knowing how things do work, it was one of the reasons that kept us from buying in Dubai. We asked ourselves a lot of "what ifs" and seeing as how there was not answer to most of them, we decided not to purchase. If you know that selling something that doesn't exist is fraud, then why did you buy?? You thought you saw an opportunity and jumped on it, as did many. If things hadn't gone belly up I'm sure you would be a happy camper counting your profit rather than your lose. Red Chief
I ain't Gertrude but I partly agree and partly disagree with you. 8)
I agree that buying something off-plan is some sort of gambling but I disagree that such a gambler is always an "investor".
You forgot that most people came to Dubai from different backwaters (not Europe or US) and it isn't a surprise that they wanted to stay here forever. When you are young you don't think about pension a lot. :wink:
You know that having 12-15K dirhams salary it's hardly possible to take a credit in bank for property.
For these people contractors developed special off-plan sceme: no downpayment at all and then paying every month tp reach 30% during the stage of constraction . Such way the contractor was trying to avoid special deposit accounts that was designated by government only for buying constraction materials.
So a lot of people was affected and it's necessary to recover the cinfidence. Bora Bora
On the face of it, the MAJORITY of those who bought were looking at the purchase as an investment. I can't imagine that there were that many who were from the "backwaters" as you put it, would consider it a place to retire unless they were financially capable of doing so. Possibly many may have looked at the purchase as a "second home", not a permanent home.
As the real estate market continually became inflated most were looking at the profit that they were going to see on this "investment". I know someone who got in at the bottom and purchased 3 properties on the Palm, each running about AED 5 Mil. Well he had plenty of opportunity to sell these properties at a lovely profit as he got offers up to AED19 Mil. each. Well wifey said: don't accept 19Mil we can get more. She wasn't happy with a profit of AED42 Mil, she wanted more. That was like a USD10 Mil windfall. Well guess what? They held on, the market crashed, and they are now renting them out just to cover the mortgage payments. This is where greed got her. They will never ever see an offer even close to the AED19 Mil that wasn't enough for her.
I also had a friend who was purchasing off-plan. He asked me to take a look at the contract. Well he handed me a one inch thick maual!! Read the manual/contract and had many many questions. What I told him was that it boiled down to the fact that the developer was free and clear of any and all liability. Where there was liability it fell to the purchaser. I told him that I would never sign such a document. We went to the office of the developer and spoke to the "salesman". When I asked my questions regarding the contract, I got one of two answers: (1) I'll have to get back to you on that; or (2) I don't understand. What I gathered is that many people hardly read the contracts or failed to understand them. Red Chief He-He, I ain't going to fight but I have another experience. On the other hand majority of Dubai's population IS from the backwater according to statistics. So my statement is at least highly probable. Moreover I know a few people who had sold their houses in different STANS and then bought in Dubai. Secondly buying a flat insted of renting it looked rather attractive because as a rule puchasing price was equal 10 years of rents. It could have been rather short term investment for family in their 30s. So I don't quite understand your point about retirement. I agree that 2-3 years ago off-plan was crazy but for another reason than you gave. The crisis on the US real estate had been continuing for a few years. Why somebody thought that Dubai was a quet harbour I didn't understand at that time. In conclusion it doesn't matter who lost money "investors" or "office plankton" there is no confidence after that neithter from expats nor from foreigner. Ooops it sounds exactly the same as in my previous post. I forgot to stop the conversation in time before getting Borring. :wink: I'm done. Chocoholic Look basically there are do's and don'ts when buying off plan. Safest bet is to stick to a master developer. I also bought in Sports City, but a development from Sport City itself, yes the thing is delayed but at least it will be finished. Building is 75% complete. Now the issue I'm having with them at the moment is, that according to contracts and RERA, for every quarter there is a delay, they are supposed to compensate you! Which they deny, but it is pretty standard, so I'm obviously looking into it. Anyway cheers for hijacking the thread! One of my best mates left this morning - so sad :cry: Bora Bora
When you say the majority of the population is from the "backwater"? Where the hell is the backwater? And what are the different STANS?
And people didn't look at what was happening in the US, all they saw was money, money, money in Dubai and went on the assurances that Dubai was solid. Bora Bora
Oh, sorry Chocs for the hijacking. I guess it's one of those
it's OK for me to do, but don't you".
Oh, here's a tissue hon.

Have a good weep. sage & onion :wav: :wav: :wav: :wav: :wav: :wav: :wav: Bora Bora ^^^^^^^^^^^LMAO!!! Actually I thought it was pretty good myself!!! Red Chief
What does it mean? Did you go to a fortune-teller recently?
As for developer you could have been lucky or unlucky, that's it.
He-he, Bora, Chocks looks like a representative of that middle class, whom I was talking about as a buyer to live, not "the pure investor".
As far as I understand delay has been for at least 1,5 years and the building is not finnished and Chocks has rented a flat for the time of promised construction plus delay.
Hope such a gambling worths the cost of rent and nerves. arniegang back on topic please peeps Bora Bora
That pretty much sums it up. Chocoholic FFS! Of course it's a gamble, everything in life is a gamble. And no RC, with master developers - they HAVE to finish the project, delayed or not, because their developments are normally part of the infrastructure of the project as a whole. And no I have not been having to fork out for somewhere else in the mean time, but as of the beginning of next year, yes I will be. Red Chief
He He. How did you know that the project was going to start as a whole? My acquaintance had deal with a MASTER developer too in the plot nearby but there has been no changes with that enormous sandpit for 2 years.
Ok, believe in whatever you want. My congratulation if one day your property will have been completed and you will have your piece of life.
Only one question. Why did you choose off-plan insted of puchasing built property in credit? Chocoholic Because at the time, it was a better deal and who could have predicted what would happen - nobody could do that. Which developer is your friend with? Been chatting to a quite a few people in real estate recently and the general feeling seems to show that as projects near completion, they are pretty easy to off-load, the market is still quite fluid for completed or nearly completed properties. With mine, it's fine Sport City keep me updated, I've been to see the site and it's progressing pretty quickly now, so at this stage I'm not too concerned about it.



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