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artificial islands


raidah before i decided to post this topic, i made a little research. there r a lot more artificial islands that one might think. some have airports, others buildings, beaches on them, etc. without any doubt the man-made islands from dubai r the most well known it the world. but for how long can they last? everybody is so overwhelmed by what is going on there, including me. fake or not, its amazing. but i surely would not wanna be there in case of a natural disaster. so i was wondering if anyone has read, heard or knows any of those "dirty" details that r kept away from the public. or just give ur opinion.
Sara1983
Oh man those islands in Dubai
are really affecting the marine life
badly, yeah I've done a research
on that. HOW are they gonna manage
all that dunno, there gonna be bad
results in the future on the marine
life, including the coral reefs etc etc etc etc
I used to look at those islands as a WOW
thing, well they're, but after that research
you see its coOL to have 'em. But hey
look after the life under the sea, don't
hurt what's down there!!!! Liban Montreal has an artificial island about 10 minutes from the downtown core that was used from earth taken out during the building of its metro... Its been there since the mid-60s and shows no signs of sinking... Then again, Canada doesn't hire unskilled Indians and pay them $0.10/hour, work them 24 hours a day, and expect the thing to be finished in 1/4 the normal time :) raidah :P the island projects in dubai r huge. and skilled or unskilled workers, there had to be a lot of mental work before starting the actual contructions. im only thinking that if u mess with nature, sooner or later it will hit back. by now we have a lot of geological, geographical etc. knowledge but nature is still not predictible enough. hmmm...what u think, "bud"? :P fayz
They're called Native Americans back home Liban
There is a difference.... Indian migrants here work for peanuts and have to pay for everything including their residency visas!!!
In Canada its the opposite. The tax payers pay the natives to sit on their asses all day and do shitall while they get free housing, free electricity, discounted food, discounted gas, cigarrettes, etc... On top of that they are among the richest bums in Canada.... Dubai Knight The artificial 'Islands' of Dubai have just about decimated the natural ecology of the area, changed the long shore drift pattern of the coastal strip and, according to some experts, will erode very quickly. The words 'shifting sands' come to mind. Was recently lucky enough to visit the World and walk around on the 'reclaimed' land. It is already eroding and being cut into by the currents, so there will be a lot of stabilisation required. The lack of water movement in the fingers of the Palm will mean that they will either stagnate or the sand will gradually reclaim the area. Without constant dredging, The Palm will lose its shape and become 'The Blob' :? :? :? Knight the_zooter
Hmmm - not quite what will attract the tourists!
I can see the adverts now:
"Come to Dubai, stay on the world famous Jemeirah Blob; take a trip round the World - it might not be here next week!" dbxsoul
agreed, i worked on JP about 4 years back, absolute hell on earth in summer. if you thought the humidity was bad in dubai in summer then surround yourself with water and see what happens. of course it also acts as the worlds largest sea water rubbish strainer, and the comment about the stagnating water is completly justified.
maybe arnie has some ideas of what the long term maintenance levies will look like...
i still know a few people working there, some of the horror stories reach legendary preportions! arniegang The long term "management charges" seriously concern me. My prediction is give it a few years there will some bargins to be had on all the "palms"

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the_zooter
You and your property bargains!!!
But will it be a bargain if there is nothing left of it?!?! :lol: arniegang nah it will stay, but the bargins will be had, following the year they make all the residents pay for the remedial works. The cost will be massive. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: the_zooter
Surely they can't make people pay for the remedial works?? That's crazy. Couldn't they claim that the land isn't fit for purpose or something??
I hope that most of the remedial work is required around the Beckhams place!! :lol: arniegang Of course they can Zooter, thats why i dumped off last year 8) 8) 8) 8) hashman Well I guess it was waste of money making those islands but Dubai did gain publicity. The mantainence cost for maintaining those islands must be huge. Now I heard Dubai is making Las Vegas style casinos and world's largest hotel. I guess some sectors of Dubai economy really needs to be looked up on b4 wasting these dollars on tourism sector. the_zooter
Casinos?? In Dubai?? Surely not? Goes against the grain really I'd have thought? dbxsoul mmmm .. i've heard about this one before as well. floating casino's that can be taken out into international waters before bandits can have thier arms pulled. then again look that the "richest horse race in the world", where do you think that happens... although there are no cash prizes i would guess that plenty of bets are placed internationally dbxsoul
i think this is the case with all of the new developments, buildings in the region are not designed to last a 1000 years. just have a look at some of the state of some of the older buildings (10 years+) in karama, deira and along shk zayed road; construction techknowledgy may have improved, but the environment will still be as agressive in the future.
imagine buying in the marina, planning to live out your retirement years there, then after 5 or 10 years the elevators have to be replaced, the coping on the building keeps falling off and has to be redone..... the list goes on... benwj
If you can afford to buy there, I don't think maintenance charges are going to worry you.
arniegang Benj Wrong, the launch prices in 2002 were so cheap thats why the bandwagon started. In the case og Palm J, no-one has completed yet. Like in other recent dvelopments, because of resales, there is a major difference between someone putting down a deposit, and then having to find the balance. Wannabe investors/developers who have little experience in a established property market, are starting to get their "fingers burnt" because thay cant raise the finance to complete. This is evident in the new developments on the Marina that are completing right now. Developers are holding onto empty properties because the purchasers cannot complete the final payments. The situation will continue to worsten as more developments come to completion. Furthermore, if people have to borrow money to purchase, it doesnt mean they have the means to pay the Annual Maint Charges. For example my charge is 14k Dhs per year. I estimate the maintenance charges for the Palms to be wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy in excess of that. Watch this space my friend. the_zooter So bargains soon to be had in the Marina you think too?? Will all these "corrections" have any effect on rental prices?? Arnie - will you be jumping in to grab a few bargains in the Marina and JBR then, along with maybe the Palms? arniegang You got it zoots Its gonna soon be a case of have "i have the cash take it or leave it", i'm sooooooo happy 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) arniegang Sold my Palms at an embarassing profit Zoots, my sights are clearly set on JBR. :D :D the_zooter If only I knew anything about buying properties - I'm going to have to pick your brains sometime Arnie and get a crash course on buying property! I think JBR is going to look and be really good when its finished, but if and when I move to Dubai, I still think I'd prefer to get a place in the Marina - maybe its because JBR is just a huge building site at the moment, so I can't fully picture what its going to be like (thats what you get for having a number crunching mind, rather than a creative one!) G If and when I move to Dubai you can be sure I'll be renting!! I know a few people who've recently sold up and they are sooo pleased to have got out of that market!! arniegang G My sights are clearly set on the holiday rental market. It hardly exists at the moment. My appartment when i'm not there is bringing me in after deductions 600 Dhs a Day (about £90). the_zooter
Its a big market in much of Europe and places like Florida, so no reason why it shouldn't eventually be the case in Dubai! G Interesting and valid point Arnie!! You say the market hardly exists yet...on average what % of the time are you managing to rent out your pl;ace when your not there? arniegang Around 2 weeks in 4 mate. But the market is so new, companies in the UK havent really got into DXB as a rental market, because there is none. But in comparrison to £140k properties i have in UK producing taxable net returns of 6/7%, i and well happy with 20% tax free :D :D ajb Arnie, You seem to know alot about property in Dubai so I was wondering if you could tell me who the most reputable developers in the region are? Only reason Im asking is I have a second interview with a developer in the coming weeks. Zooter if you are serious about wanting to know more about property investing Id suggest the first step is to buy some books on the topic and see what type of investing grabs your attention - personally I would recommend reading some of John Burley's material his work is not onyl about investing but he spends a good deal of time on the principles of moeny & wealth. best of luck arniegang AJB The big players are Nakheel and Emaar. The big private dev is Damac. ajb sweet thanks - on the right track then! dannyM
The JBR towers might not be the greatest looking buildings but the jbr walk or whatever it's called should be great. The towers themselves are starting to look better now as they get closer to completion

Anyone hear the latest news about damac? Apparently their sales have been going pretty badly and they're really dependant on pre-sales which is probably the reason why their projects are constantly delayed, hell ocean heights hasn't even started.
If casinos are built in Dubai they'll be built in dubailand. The new al bawadi project looks more like du-vegas than anything so they should be there if they'll be built. benwj
Bawadi aka DuVegas, will have nearly 30,000 hotel rooms (nearly double Dubai's current capacity) and, is predicted to attract over 3 million tourists per year. I don't think that Bawadi will attract these numbers without casinos, but I cannot see casinos being built in a muslim country, surrounded by other muslim countries. Even if it is made a free zone, which is technically not part of the UAE etc etc.
This is not because it would be a flop, but far from it. They would have to double the size of Bawadi to cope with the demand.
However, I would still like to know where they are getting their figures from without the attraction of casinos. benwj
There is a big difference bewteen the Palm and the Marina/JBR. The Palm may have been cheap to you, but it has always been at the upper end of the market. When you have this much money to spend, maintenance charges and morgages are not going to be a problem.
The Marina and JBR were both affordable when you consider that you could purchase several of these apartments for the price of a villa on the Palm.
It is these that I'll be watching. arniegang Benjw I am quite aware of the prices on the Palm JBR and the Marina i owned properties on all 3 till last year. I do not have a mortgage on my properties and this is because i am wise. The reason i dumped off the my Palm properties was a/ the ridiculous profit i made and b/ the estimated management charges. Dont assume just because someone can afford to buy a property where ever, it automatically is presumed they will pay anything to keep it. A property in my eyes needs to "pay its keep". If it doesnt in relation to the amount paid for it, then it goes. I could easilly have afforded the management charges, this was never an issue. I merely wasnt prepared to pay for it. benwj
Sorry about that Arnie. Despite, how it sounded, that wasn't meant to be personal attack.
I was talking generally. My point was that the Palm is a highly exclusive development that attracts people with a lot of spare cash. They won't mind paying extra to tell their aquaintances back home that they own/live on "The Palm". I would say that most of the investors such as yourself have offloaded their properties to people such as this. ajb It would all depend on the persons motivation i.e. investor vs owner occupier. Some wealthy owners will not mind paying higher costs as they "just have to!!" live there, some investors who don't know how to calculate their returns properly may hang tight hoping for continued captial gains (hope and hold), professional investors will reevaluate the returns being made on each property based on its current value not its hirtorical purchase price. Alot of people dont do this and falsely inflate the return they are achieving.



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