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200 car pile up en rotue to abu dabi...


JMK - use normal yellow light or fog lights - choose proper speed i.e braking distance should not exceed distance of visibilty - define hidden in the fog objects/cars/camels by looking out for objects of lighter tones, as they are less visible normally - open windows and listen -keep to your lane - use wipers - put your favourite CD and make it loud so people can hear you if not see you ... these are general rules that I follow and thanks God, no accidents so far .. :) .
gezza can any one give me an update on this?? gezza ^ian^ From the article: "He added: “The accident was a combination of fog and people using their hazard lights. I only escaped with a bruise.” " What a total Deutsche Douche. How does using Hazard lights cause accidents? If anything it's to warn people of.... guess what... a HAZARD like 40 cars piled up and catching on fire! Here's a thought... when it's foggy and you can't see 10 metres in front of you... SLOW DOWN! craigindubai Khamis I. Mohammad, deputy of traffic and patrol Abu Dhabi police said:
There's a surprise....

But remember it's still compulsory to use your mobile phone whilst driving and any driver caught using indicators legitimately will be penalised. ^ian^ There's actually some kind of weird obsession going on with drivers who use hazard lights when it is foggy like it is a bad thing. Not every car is equipped with fog lights, and I actually find it helpful to see the hazard lights through the fog instead of the the rear end of a car appearing out of nowhere. There is only one cause for an accident like this, and that is speeding. And I don't mean speeding as in exceeding the speed limit, I mean speeding in excess of what could be deemed safe. gezza
I agree mate.
can you tell me the best radio station to get travel news??
do you reckon the roads will be clear comming back from A.D yet? Flying Dutchman Sad thing is, I donot expect anybody to learn from this. ebonics i saw the aftermath of the pileup, bu tnot the pileup itself.... the roads were rediculous. reviewer Just posted some pics of the pile up, it was frigthening, never imagined it could end up like this because of the "fog"... :cry:

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^ian^
It's not because of the Fog... it's because of the reckless and stupid driving. reviewer
Yes, dear I understood the real cause was speeding, thats why I put the word fog inside a quote mark.... 8) ....Moving on.... CVB
Two immediate reasons I can think of why people shouldn't use their hazzard lights.
One is because you can't tell when somebody is going to change lanes and cut infront of you, although that's kind of just a supposition because the chances of half the UAE road users don't know what the indicator is for.
the second reason almost caused me to crash today.
Driving to work through the usual blink blink of the hazzard lights I came accross a particularly thick patch of fog.
Being a sensible kind of guy I (fortunately) wasn't going fast. A set of hazzard lights suddenly appeared in front of me (in the middle lane) and I slowed down as they didn't appear to be moving very fast.
Suddenly it became apparent that they were not moving at all. the bus that they belonged to had hit the back of a car and they were actually stopped.
If people didn't use their hazzards instead of their normal lights than I would have known that the hazzards were for an actual hazzard. abdulnafees








abdulnafees What a big disaster ^ian^
Er... a hazard is still a hazard. Whether the bus was going 0 ro 30 k/h you needed to take action.
What would have happened if they didn't have any hazard lights on at all? ebonics im with ian, i encountered such thick fog on the way back from dubai once, and hazard lights were the only plausable way to tell if there's someone infront of you. if its such conditions, you shouldnt be changing lanes, swirving in and out, move in a straight line where you can see the person infront of you at bay and keep triple your distance that you'd normally keep and for fcks sakes SLOW THE FCK DOWN people were flying past at speeds upwards of 120, and i witnessed at least 6 isolated accidents on the road that night. craig in dubai said it best, people here in a great hurry to speed their life away.. benwj
I admit that I subscibe to this weird obsession.
Because people who use there hazard lights in the fog are the same idiots who:
don't use their indicators to change lanes,
flash their high beam at people from 1 kilometer away to tell them to get out of the way,
cross 6 lanes of traffic to exit the freeway from the fast lane
let their kids jump all around the car with no seat belt
all while talking on their mobile phone
Using your logic, if hazard lights are for when you pose a hazard, perhaps these drivers should use them permanently.
I agree that speed is the cause of accidents in fog.
However there is no need for hazard lights if you are travelling at a safe speed and can see the cars in front of you. Encouraging the use of them in fog only encourages people to go faster.
Unfortunately, I will spend the next week at work deleting emails from the same idiots who use their hazard lights in fog, containing pictures of severed and chared bodies from the accident. bonk
What about putting bright blue and red flashing lights on the roof of every car. You'd see them better in fog then, and you could speed up. Perhaps smaller ones could be incorporated into special hats for pedestrians to wear on their heads during fog also :shock:
If you can't see a car in front of you unless they've got hazard lights on, then you're driving too fast. If the fog is so thick you have to stop, then stop.
That crash today no doubt happened because of people driving too fast for the conditions but I bet drivers who had their hazard lights on were a contributing factor. As soon as the first accident happened, what could following cars do to warn people behind them, if they already had their hazard lights on? Switch them off?
There is a good reason why the UAE police keep saying do not drive with your hazard lights on in fog (or rain).
Chocoholic I'm going to back Ian up on the hazard light issue, and that if you DON'T HAVE FOG LIGHTS ON YOUR CAR!!!!! Better use something that will allow you to be seen, than nothing at all. There are no fog lights on my car at all!!! I'm not surprised at the accident and quite frankly have no sympathy for the morons who caused it or were involved, because clearly they still don't know how to drive in adverse weather conditions and carry on driving like idiots. They won't learn! Until next time! bonk
And what should camels use so they can be seen clearly in fog? What about bicycles? And vehicles without hazard lights?
If you cannot see a 2 ton object in front of you because it doesn't have flashing lights, then you are driving too fast.

You're being a little harsh on yourself I feel but then people are often their own worst critics. ^ian^
I'm not worried about me driving too fast, I'm worried about the idiot behind me. I'm doing it to protect myself, not them. If I was riding a bicycle in fog, I would have an orange flashy light. If I was a camel on SZR in fog, I would definitely want orange flashy lights.

Well, I think it is doubtless speed caused the accident, but I don't think any hazard lights contributed to the accident, possibly prevented some people crashing actually.
In the absence of anything to say "hey watch out I am here!" in pea soup fog, you can bet I will have my hazard lights on. bonk
Righto. Just like 198 cars on the Abu Dhabi highway today who, by driving with their hazard lights on, therefore switched off their option of saying "hey watch out there's been a crash in front of me."
Do you honestly think that your hazard lights make any difference to the fool coming up your rear end at 150 km per hour?
They do however make a difference to the sensible driver behind you doing 30 km per hour ... when you switch them on to say there's been a crash in front of you. Chocoholic Bonk, you have to realise that many of these heavy vehicles, hardly have any lights that work at all - let alone fog or hazard lights, many of them are dark in colour and you literally will not see them until they're right in front of your bonnet - no matter how slow you're going. These guys are a serious danger on the roads in most conditions let alone fog. If the fog is that bad, I'd actually prefer not to even consider getting into my car until it's lifted. Hey I'm used to driving in all sorts of weather conditions, but you have to bear in mind some people here will never have experienced fog or rain and simply don't know how to behave in adverse weather. Most people here rarely look beyond the end of their bonnet at the best of times. Chocoholic So Bonk, go on tell me! I have no fog lights on my car! What should I do? Wait until someone climbs in my boot? ^ian^
Correct. You should smile as the Rangerover Sports limited going at 200 Kph bisects your car straight down the middle.
This whole argument of hazard lights cause accidents is the biggest load of laughable bollocks ever.
So it pisses people off who have fog lights. Big freaking deal, it does stop accidents. Specifically, it will stop someone running in to me or someone close, which lets face it chumps, is all I freaking care about... since that's all you care about. bonk
Switch on your normal lights. I have no fog lights either and that's what I do.
As for the trucks with no lights, I agree they're a menace, but I don't understand how you driving with your hazard lights on makes them safer. bonk
I don't expect it will make any difference to me since I plan to be far enough behind you to stop if you get into trouble.
I don't expect it will make any difference to the lunatic doing 100+ since he will run into you if you stop, even if you have a lighthouse welded to the roof of your car. But anyway, usually they're in the fast lane so if you stay out of that, you improve your chances of not getting hit by them.
It will make a difference to the guy going 35 kph instead of 30 kph, or travelling 10 car lengths behind you instead of 11 car lengths. When you stop suddenly for whatever reason, you won't be able to warn them, they'll drive another 20m before they figure out you've actually stopped and it'll be too late, they'll crash in to you. If he had his hazard lights on, he won't be able to warn the car behind him who might crash into him, and so on and so on ...
Those drivers aren't the ones tearing down the highway in rocketships, they're the ordinary drivers like you and me who might be distracted momentarily - a kid in the back whines about something, change the CD, the radio station, look at the phone to see who's ringing, clean that smudge on the windscreen, grab a tissue because you're about to sneeze. In fog you can't afford to take your eyes off the road for a second, unlike in clear day where you have a much greater awareness of what's happening around you.

I don't have fog lights. It annoys me because it means those drivers have disabled their emergency warning system. dubaidog
Hey Chocs I agree about the lousy truck lighting. 100% However, fog lights are an option on light vehicles. The rear ones are exceptionally crappy as they look like brake lights.
Hazard lights/flashers are for STATIONARY HAZARDS, they are not "hey I might drive like an asshole" lights. How many times have you been lapped in fog by a guy doing 140 with the hazards going?
People that drive with hazard lights on when it is rainy/foggy should be shot......especially when they are driving faster than conditions allow. ^ian^
Next to the hazard lights... there's these things called brake lights.
They only come on when you put your foot on the brake pedal. ^ian^
Dumbest, comment, ever.
Retards should be shot first, then the rest of us wouldn't have to worry about... well... anything. dubaidog
Exactly.......fog lights are a premium acces. and don't matter when you are driving like a dick when conditions are not right.
Take it from one who has driven in snow/blizzards for 20 years. Hazards mean you are in trouble or are pulled over as a stationary hazard. bonk
And what is the point of brake lights?
Hint, be careful when answering, you don't want to end up shooting yourself :wink: ...
^ian^
To tell people you are braking.
Hazard lights - look out - there's a hazard... which to me fog counts.
Brake lights - look out - I am stopping
Indicators - look out - I am turning / changing lanes
Reverse lights - look out - I am reversing
High Beams - look out - you're driving the wrong direction!
Shesh... no wonder there's so many accidents here. ^ian^
Notice I said "rest of us".
I still don't get why people get so emotional about the hazard light thing. Anything that could raise the alertness of another driver in dangerous conditions should be considered a GOOD thing. Chocoholic Well to break it down into basics. If you do not have fog lights, which are high intensity lights, your hazard lights are of a higher intensity than your normal low beam headlights and rear lights. Using your high beam is just stupid, as basically all you do is light up a wall of white, you should never ever use high bean in fog - it's blinding - to you! So failing having fog lights, my hazard lights will enable people to see me long before they see my standard front and rear lights - ergo, the use of them is a better warning than not using them. Any problem with that? Eat my shorts! bonk
I didn't think I was getting emotional.
That you don't get it sums it up really. You've almost persuaded me that it probably is best for other road users if you keep your hazard lights on. ^ian^
Not specifically saying YOU get emotional, but people DO get emotional. You only need to read 7 days to know this. bonk
The problem is that you appear to be someone fairly coherent and intelligent C, rather than completely clueless about how to drive. Until now I had assumed hazard light users were just uneducated drivers unfamiliar with foggy conditions.
I now have an even greater appreciation for the difficult job the UAE police have. bonk Ok, here's my last attempt for today. C or ian, have either of you heard the story of The Boy Who Cried Wolf? Or The Hazard Lights That Cried Watch Out? Chocoholic I would agree with you if, IF every car here had fog lights on them. However they don't, that's a plain and clear fact. Simple point is I'd rather be seen, than not. And until they come up with 'add on' fog lights, that's the way it's got to be. In any other situation, I agree that hazard lights are a no no, unless you are actually waring people. But when it comes to fog, it's a catch 22, to be seen or not to be seen, I know what I choose. dubaidog
The only problem is when EVERYONE has their hazards on, it is like they are saying "hey, it's foggy, I'll drive more foolish than normal". When you are driving (defensively) with your hazards on, there is no difference than anyone else on the road. No one knows which way you are signaling, only that you are a nervous driver. Keep your hazards OFF, then when I approach you, I know that you are normal and may react to the same conditions I am in.
(not you chocs) But why have your hazards on and pass me at 140 as many do? benwj
Or to put it another way:
to be seen as an idiot or not seen as an idiot...
I don't think that you are one of these idiots, but if I see a car with hazard lights on in the fog I assume that they are an idiot.
Explain this then:
How does anyone else know when you are going to change lanes or turn if your hazard lights are on?
Why is it that in fog people use their hazard lights, but when the fog clears they don't use there turn indicators which is by far a lot easier to do?
Actually, It is a lot safer in the fog because then I can easily identify the idots on the road and give them a wide berth. sage & onion Hazard Warning Lights should not be switched on during foggy conditions unless you are at a complete standstill. The sooner every driver in the UAE learns this lesson the better. quatroporte
Dear Ian...
I understand your point of view.... But to put an end of the story...
IT IS ILLEGAL TO DRIVE USING HAZARD LIGHTS IN FOG! this rule is set by the police department.
please call them and check...
Hazard light is ONLY and ONLY when your car is stopped or there is a hazard ahead where you need to warn everyone behind you.
FOG or Rain are not hazards... those are bad weather conditions!
did you guys remember the bad rainy days? can you believe there where drivers use hazard lights even in the rain?!?!?
Thats why the police department put the blame on the Hazard lights this time...
(Not keeping distance and the miss-use of hazard lights) this is according to the FM news this morning.
yes, there was speeding cars... however... not all the trucks, busses, and everyone was driving on speed... the main reason is why because due to thick fog... people was not able to tell if the hazard flash infront of them is to warn them due to an accident... or it is from another driver scared and he is flashing his hazard lights while driving.
everytime the country get into fog conditions... the police ALWAYS advice drivers to drive slowly and NOT to use Hazard lights... but no one listen (I guess)
as I said... I understand everyone opinion... but this debate is simply answered by the police Dept.
just my two fils :) john smith
Please explain how a 21 watt rear light lamp has more "intensity" than a 21 watt indicator lamp?
You should only use hazards when stopped or when you are warning someone of an impending hazard. You don't need to tell other people it's foggy when it's foggy or raining when it's raining.
I think the police should be stricter about who they give licences too. i.e only people who are used to driving in civilised developed cities, i.e UK, france, germany etc. No australians, indians, pak etc. and absolutely no idiot women who say they have no sympathy for anyone involved in a horrific crash which claimed many lives. bonk People driving too fast in fog are a hazard. People driving with hazard lights on are a hazard. How do you learn how dangerous you are? A. Understand a rational explanation why. B. Get fined by the traffic police. C. Be involved in, or cause an accident as a result of your lack of understanding, and survive. D. Die. The speeding drivers are likely to be a lost cause but I hope the hazard light users are not as arrogant, and can still learn. C and ian, either you aren't able to learn from method A, or explanations from me and several others aren't clear enough. I don't know how I can make it clearer so I hope you learn from method B rather than C or D. If you really think you are right, then tear apart my explanation of how hazard light users contributed to yesterday's pile-up. No one has yet. quatroporte
nice one :lol: St.Lucifer
Absolutely tragic accident. Felt really bad abt it. but people in here are more interested in covering the sensational news than anything. Read somewhere 'Dubai: Worlds largest road accident, watch it now' .
I dont see the logic in how, shouting out to people that there are 100 cars piled ahead of me and i'm stopping now or trying to get to a side to avoid accident and switching on Hazard lights can cause 100 more vehciles to lose control and hit each other. ebonics im still standing my ground advocating hazard lights, hell ill say that the police dont know what they're talking about if htey're saying not to turn them on. like chocoholic said, better be seen than not be seen at all.. if you got hazard lights on and you're changing lanes, then you're a bloody idiot. hazard lights, drive slow, stick to your lane, keep the person infront of you at bay where you can just see his lights but giving you enough time to react if he comes to a stand still..... the problem is, even if you do all the right things by the road and yourself, you'll get collected from the back by an absolute moron of a human being. bonk
Being able to switch on hazard lights might have reduced the number of cars involved. See my earlier explanation. ebonics
jesus christ, the problem isnt in the bloody hazard lights, its in the next 50 cars travelling at 150 km/her in conditions where you shouldnt be going over 60!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
im sorry but traffic police here are far from competant, or qualified... sage & onion
Adding to the problem of High speed is people like you who have no idea what you are doing. If traffic regulation state that you should not drive with your Hazard Warning Lights on, then that is what we all should do. ebonics is that why they call me a rating one driver where i come from?
where i come from also quotes:

common sense prevails......
here is the exact law article

the fact that i get a driving license the day i step in here with no tests or anything similar, is testament that my driving provisions where i come from are adaquate...
this is a country where people dont stop for people at a pedestrian crossing
so if anyone here says i shouldnt turn them on can bite me. - because that makes 0 sense. ebonics put all that aside, if you stop / crash / breakdown - you'd turn them on so your logic, bonk, that they contributed to the extension of the pileup is just rediculous.. sage & onion
It matters not where you come from, it matters that you are here and if the regulations here state that you should not drive with your Hazard Warning Lights on then obey the rules and stop adding to the confusion on the roads. ebonics mate - what confusions?
if the first car crashed, they'll turn their hazards on so not to get rear ended, the fact that they got rear ended - means the person that rear ended them was A) speeding B) not looking at the road
i fail to see how the hazards are blamed on this.
here people dont stop at a pedestrian crossing to let pedestrians go - doesnt make it right.
here you only get booked when you're 40km/hr above speed limit - doesnt make it right
here you're told not to turn them on - doesnt make it right. sage & onion
All of this is totally irrelevant, you should follow the regulations, because that is what we all are expected to do and expect others to do. When you decide to do what you want which is outside of the regulations, that makes it dangerous.
BTW Try driving in a 120km zone in Dubai at 160km and see if you get flashed or not. ebonics so answer me this the first two cars that crashed, should they turn their hazards on or not? sage & onion
If a car stops or crashes it then becomes a potential hazard, so yes, they should turn on their Hazard Warning Lights if they are able to do so. Chocoholic Still you seem to have avoided my question! I DON'T HAVE FOG LIGHTS!!! So what should I use instead? I know for a FACT that you can see hazard lights from a greater distance than the standard front and rear lights. And the comment about the police being stricter about the use of hazard lights, is just silly, because until all imported cars actually have fog lights as standard, this will not happen. And another point, who the hell uses indicators here anyway?! sage & onion
Your wrong Chocs, however if it really bothers you, get Fog lights fitted. ebonics the cops here need to be re-educated from scratch. sage & onion
In this I am in agreement with you john smith
Please explain the science behind this FACT. The lamps in both indicators and rear lights are the same. In quite a lot of new (particularly US) cars the rear lights are the indictors.
Saying the wrong thing repeatedly doesn't make it right.
You are a fool. reviewer Another thing to be asked is how come there was no police presence on that part of the road where the "fog occured. Didn't they (bureau) forecast the weather as being foggy that day, so police dep't they should have posted units on that road to forewarned/caution the drivers of the danger ahead. Its been easy for them to blame others yet overlooked their own responsibilities. 8) sage & onion
How many Police would be required to post on a road like Abu Dhabi x Dubai in dense Fog, it's not really that feasible. ebonics
it is a fact that you can see a blinking light better than a still one. regardless of colour, yellow or red... as long as its blinking.
you're throwing around insults, but failing to think about what you're saying. ebonics not to mention, lincolns, which have the red light that doubles as blinkers -are the height of stupidity... many times they started blinking and you dont notice them, especially when they're in your blind spot.... again - just because it exists doesnt make it right. sage & onion
Not only Lincolns, all Vehicles with US Specs have these kind of indicators. In fact I believe that under Gulf Specs they are not allowed, yet another one of those little inconsistencies Anteater The problem is not hazard lights. The problem is not speed. The problem is not fog. The problem is people and their driving skills... or more correctly the significant lack thereof in this country. With skill development comes knowledge; about your car in all situations and about you in all situations. Flying Dutchman Does the police give a rule of thumb (in terms of meters of visibity) when fog lights should be used? ebonics
well that just makes all the sense in the world.
flying dutchman raises a good point, i can see this turning to fog headlight city - people having them on for no reason at all - they double up like high beams ebonics if anyone knows how to read arabic, the "etihad" newspaper (the main national paper of abu dhabi) has a 3 page report on the incident not once has hazard lights been mentioned in the 3 pages, or blamed.... dont know where gulf news is getting their quotes or stories from. what happened is, the first two cars that hit leaked a whole bunch of oil, the following cars lost control over the oil (and of course speeding) - then more oil ended up on the road, even the people that were travelling at 60 km/hr lost control over the gigantic oil slick that formed...... which later ignited. Chocoholic Er John Smith, it's a FACT because I use my own eyes and in fog I can see someone's hazard lights before I can see their tail lights - simple as. It's not brain surgery. It doesn't matter the fact that you have the same voltage in both sets of lights, orange is a brighter colour and therefore penetrates more, not to mention that fact that blinking lights are easier to see. Why do you think all road construction areas use uuuhhhh ohhhh 'Orange blinking lights'! Clearly you are blind - get off the road! bonk
And hopefully you'll still be able to stand your ground after someone has smashed in to you because you couldn't warn them you'd stopped.
If you are a relatively safe driver, then you are far more likely to be hit in the rear by another relatively safe, but perhaps distracted, driver because you couldn't warn them you'd done an emergency stop.
If you're doing 30 kph in the fast lane in fog, then hazard lights are not going to save you from being rear-ended by someone doing 150 kph. bonk
I am astonished. In which country is this suggestion made? bonk
You contradicted yourself. Or me. Or someone.
How can you turn on your hazard lights after you crash if you already had them on? That's exactly my point why you shouldn't have them on when driving normally. bonk
Yes, I know. And that's why you scare me as much as the lunatics doing 150 kph. bonk
Yes. But how can they if they were already on? You keep making the same point as me but missing it entirely. You seem to be the online equivalent of someone who can't even hit the floor when falling down. bonk
I did answer your question, a couple of pages ago. Switch on your lights. I don't have fog lights either. bonk
Exactly. bonk
They already do, and have done ever since I've lived here. bonk
Gulf News said police officials. SCY Good read. Just a thought, are the driving schools teach all the function of different kinds of car lights and when to use it? I doubt not. I believe road accidents happen due to driver's attitude and non-application of some common sense. bonk I'm still waiting for all the hazard light users to rip apart my argument for keeping them off except for emergencies:
^ian^
If you suddenly stop your brake lights come on. It was said earlier.
I'm tired of this argument, I win. MaaaD you guys dont get it .. this was just another "worlds biggest, largest, most amazing" ... car accident !!! one more thing for guinness book of records. bonk
Brake lights come on whether a car is slowing down gradually or suddenly stops. They serve a different purpose to hazard warning lights. You really don't get it do you?

Bravo.
I wasn't trying to win an argument, I was trying to explain how you could become a safer driver. If you choose not to, so be it. People who drive safely shouldn't be directly affected by your decision, but you will be - your chances of being hit by an inattentive driver are higher.
I accept I've failed to convince you of that, so yes, I guess you've won. ^ian^
Correct... now lets go eat ice cream. sage & onion Once more, it is simple, all drivers obey the same set of rules and we may stay alive longer. Those of you who want to make it up as you go along only serve to endanger your own and more importantly other peoples lives. ebonics bonk - blinking yellow lights means some sh*t went down, stop or slow down or keep your distance..... be that a crash, fog, an animal crossing the road, anything. if you see hazards, you act accordingly, if they're stationary you stop, if they're moving you have the choice of indicating and moving off that lane, or putting your hazards on AND STICKING TO YOUR LANE (that is imperitive) if the hazards are on and someone tail ends you, its the 2nd parties fault. bonk, the law above is fedral australian traffic law, proven to be perfectly safe, and is the law that MAKES SENSE... anyone that thinks it doesnt make sense must question their logic gulf news quoted some police official, this quote wasnt mentioned in the cause of the accident in the national newspaper... nor were hazards mentioned. i think this is case closed. ^ian^
Correct, therefore I propose the only people allowed to participate in the remainder of this discussion are people who have never had a fine for a traffic infringement of any nature .
Otherwise you know, it would be hypocrisy. ebonics
agreed, dont argue with rating one drivers. ebonics think of when an oversized vehicle carrying an oversized load is moving, sometimes a small truck moves behind it, WITH ITS HAZARDS ON, with a sign on the back in bright yellow saying OVERSIZED its hazards are on - and its moving. now whats up john smith
I think the key here is "unique". I'm not sure that because one of the least densely populated places on earth adopts a policy that it should automatically be assumed to be correct or appropriate worldwide. Seriously, there's 5 people living in australia, am I supposed to think that they know better than the 7 billion elsewhere.??? ^ian^
If they're Australians then the obvious answer is 'Yes'.
Duh! ebonics
mr smith, it makes sense and that is the bottom line.... anything else makes no sense, if you dont believe this, there's fundamentally something wrong with you, and its no wonder you're no aussie. :lol: :lol:
7 billion, a few billion of them live in asia, africa, south america - that are deemed instant disqualification.
in 2004, australia had the third least road fatality rate of a population over 20 million, 3rd to germany and japan.
germans are the worlds best drivers, thats a given... and the japanese are unbelievably sophisticated and disciplined.
it clocked in 12th on a global scale, but all the populations that precede it other than japan and germany are no more than 16 million (netherlands) - then its a sharp drop to 4's and 5 million each (places like iceland - lol)
so maybe if the rest of the world follows suite they may save some lives, BECAUSE IT MAKES SENSE!! g00se At the end of the day, my heart goes out to all those families that have been maimed by this awful tragedy. It really does.
Far too often, it takes something like this catastrophy and the subsequent death/ injury/ inconvenience of someone "high up the food chain" [I think you know what I mean :roll: ] for things to change.
The most difficult thing to change is peoples' behaviour.
The only people who will have been REALLY altered by this pile-up will be the drivers and passengers who were involved. Doubtless they will travel more safely, leave bigger gaps between car and trvel more slowly in poor driving conditions. BECAUSE theyu have seen at first hand what the dreadful consequences can be.
Please please please ALL of us can learn from this.
Nuff said.......... reviewer
Yes indeed, we can all learn from this pile-up incident. Though it will surely take time to change people's behaviour about driving, one needs to be vigilantly attentive everytime while on the road.
This qoute says a lot......
john smith Ebonics, you've consistently through this thread proved that you are too stupid to understand or form a coherent argument. The fact that only 1 country worldwide advocates what you are saying completely floors your pathetic argument. Australia's a great country, I've spent some great times there - BUT from my personal viewpoint I would say that the standard of driving is no better than most places. Certainly tailgating and aggressive driving are pretty much the norm (would you agree?). If the accident rate is lower than other countries it is probably in large part due to having pretty good weather (not much ice, snow, fog rain), good roads, reasonable congestion levels etc. In the UK where driving standards are generally ok (on a par with most european countries I would guess but also with a liberal helping of idiots) people do not use hazard lights when in fog. In fact I would say that it wouldn't be uncommon for only 50% of people to have their foglights on (due to forgetfulness, ignorance, drifting fog etc) and in daytime you would regularly see cars in fog with no lights on. I'm not advocating this and clearly it is wrong BUT the reason I don't crash into these people is that I regulate my speed and keep a safe distance from the car in front. It is this and this alone that is the most significant thing in avoiding accidents. Hazard lights should be used to warn of an impending hazard i.e stationary cars, (or in your earlier case - vehicles travelling at disproportionally low speeds compared to other vehicles on the road) accidents, breakdowns etc. They are not an extra form of visibility and would not be needed as such if people were driving correctly. I'm not claiming to be the best driver in the world, but I've covered several hundred thousand miles on 4 wheels and 2, all over the world and this is the only place I've seen people using hazards in rain, fog etc and it's totally unnecessary and borne of ignorance and poor training. I would like to see more people learning to ride motorbikes before they drive cars - I believe this truly teaches you observation and roadcraft (due to the need to preserve your own safety) and helps you become a safer and more aware driver. I also think that everyone in the UAE should be required to take a driving test (no need for lessons unless you fail) before getting a local licence, BUT of course this would be logistically very difficult and would probably be impossible to coordinate. Interestingly, I now find myself turning into a 'dubai' driver. I drive much closer to other vehicles than I used to (you have to cos they ain't getting out of the way otherwise) and regularly undertaking (when people won't move out of the inside lanes). Hopefully I will lose these habits one day and not get killed before hand. ebonics
not at all - unless you visited northern territory
the fact that this country is the 3rd best when it comes to road tolls for countries populated over 20 million - proves it
the fact that overloaded vehicles are tailed and fronted by 2 other vehicles with hazard lights, through out their journey be it stationary or moving, further proves that if there is a possible hazard, hazard lights are what you'd use to signal it
till fog lights are a requirement on all vehicles, common sense prevails, you clearly have none. john smith See - you are too stupid to understand. I said I agreed that with a heavy load moving disproportionately slow compared with other vehicles on the road then hazard lights are appropriate. This is not the discussion. Fog is not a hazard per se, it is perfectly possible to drive in fog at reasonable speeds in perfect safety using only normal lighting, fog lights and even no lights as long as you travel at a sensible speed and a sensible stopping distance. You would only use your hazard lights to warn the vehicle behind about an approaching hazard. If you are driving along at 80km/hr in fog with no problems at all with your hazard lights flashing, how do you plan to warn the vehicle behind you in the unlikely event that there is an incident in front of you??? Seriously, I suggest less time spent on the internet (10 posts per day - you need to get out more) and more time thinking about you're inadequate driving standard. ebonics fog with visibility of 15meters ahead of you (which was the case), and you say you'd be capable of driving at 80 km/hr? and you're calling me stupid? the argument is - do not use hazards whilst moving, if construction vehicles are its quite contradictory to tell other vehicles not to, a vehicle is a vehicle. fog is deemed a hazard, but according to what you're saying, if ur driving at 80 km/hr through fog, and saying fog is no hazard - you're a hazard yourself. are you jealous of my freedom of work - so you have to comment on my posts? bonk
You've almost got it. Well done.
Yes hazard lights warn you something happened that you may not be aware of. If you need someone to switch on their hazard lights to warn you that it's foggy, then with all due respect, I don't think you should be driving at all, and I don't really think hazard lights will enlighten drivers who are unaware that it's foggy or raining. bonk
And they don't use hazard lights during normal driving in fog. They use them correctly. bonk
Yup. A question that the hazard light users have failed to answer satisfactorily, or even tried to.
Brake lights is not an answer - they inform the follower the car in front is slowing down or stopping, not that a hazard has suddenly appeared. Perceptive drivers may notice smoke from locked up wheels (difficult in fog), or hear the noise if they are driving with windows open (another useful suggestion when driving in fog). bonk
So it is. Apparently it became permitted (note the law doesn't say it's required to use hazard lights) if vehicles did not have fog lights, after a major pile up in 1980-something. I can't find any other country that allows this though so it sounds like Australia is unique with this permission.
A slight difference can be found in the Queensland version...

One country says you may use hazard lights in fog if you don't have fog lights.
Most or all other countries say do not use hazard lights when driving in fog.
I still think most other countries are correct. Chocoholic I don't care anymore. I've never had an accident or any traffic violations in the 5 years I've been here. ebonics
? JMK
that is when you are tired of listening .. :) .. JMK common ebonics, cut me some slack I am just a silly woman with lipstick in one hand and steering wheel in another ... :) . ebonics
you dont need to win me over with that, just a smile and a wink the police man and it will all be fine im sure. dubaidog [quote="bonk"]
Talk about beating a dead horse! I have not been in this argument as much as others. I like and subscribe to the above quote. Driving in bad conditions and there is one car with hazards, you know they are the risk. If everyone has them on, then it kinda defeats the purpose.
Game on...it's Thursday night..what are you all doing? I'm heading out with my fog lights and hazards on (in clear conditions) just to throw a real spanner in the works.
Oh yeah, an addendum to the above quote...don't be in the fast track doing 20 kph with the hazards on. arniegang as i received my first parking ticket this week i can make no comment :cry: :cry: rudeboy lol 200 car pile up serves them right bunch of frigging idiots. i bet it was some bus driver or a truck driver or them twin cam vans that caused this accident. they should ban buses, trucks and even them vans from the main public roads. buses travel at the speed of 120km/h on emirates road :S. and those delivery vans are blooody QUICK they touch 160km/h easily. i say BAN them all. and the worst thing is those stupid MALLLU van drives drive in the blooody FAST lane :S which blooody cheeeses me off. ebonics the conclusive evidence is oil spill on the road - end this topic. quatroporte
my friend who works in the police (specifically emirates road patrol) he told me all the major accidents happens on Emirates road are caused when an indian driver (usually malluuuu) driving so slow on the fast lane meets with a careless speeding driver!!!!
slow maluuu + careless speeding driver = Accident!
no offence to Maluuus... but my police friend DID specify them by name as well :) sage & onion What is a Maluuus??????????????????? ebonics was going to ask the same thing dubaidog I think he/she is refering to Malayalam (from India) people. Could be wrong though. rudeboy man i feel like banging my head to the table :S. sheesh u guys been in dubai for how many years now and you dont know what a malu is????? come on look around u there are EVERYWHERE!!! in the bloody shops in the taxis in supermarkets. rudeboy
mind u i can say arabs are bad drivers too. many accidents happening on the road usually does involve an arab, pakis and indians. i guess its all in the blood. no patience, hot tempared and bloody always in a hurry :S. europeans are the safest especially the brits :D they use the indicators :D. quatroporte
Arabs are hot temper *thats true* even Paki's and many indians... but Malu's are so cold and they obey the rules to a point that they drive you crazy. and bcoz of that accidents are caused.
cmon guys.. they always drive either a Nissan Suny, a mini bus or a taxi driving on the fast left lane of emirates road at 60km!!!!!!!!!!!!!
britins and most Europians drive really safe and have real manors... and I respect that... but I think you need to exclude spanish and italians... they are hot tempered too :D
*** All the above statements are just generalization, plz don't take them very serious ;) *** reviewer It would be interesting how many expats and locals were involved in the pile up....and their respective nationality....who's gonna be on top you think... 8) quatroporte
lol
I say arabs then Indians...
I am sure.. its an arab driving so fast in the fog and crashed into an indian driving on the fast lane at a very slow speed in the fog...
I dont think I need to continue the rest :) rudeboy taxi drivers, van drivers, truck drivers, bus drivers, Batrol drivers (locals), cruiser drivers (locals) are responsible for major accidents on the roads. bus drivers drive at bloody 120km/hr and the bus is packed with over 20 labourers in it and imagine a major accident involving the whole bus. same with trucks, trailers and even cement mixers. lol i once saw u mixers having a race :D. then there are those STUPID van drivers. they are bloody quick but like in abu dhabi there should be a rule in other states banning them from the fast lane. rudeboy taxi drivers, van drivers, truck drivers, bus drivers, Batrol drivers (locals), cruiser drivers (locals) are responsible for major accidents on the roads. bus drivers drive at bloody 120km/hr and the bus is packed with over 20 labourers in it and imagine a major accident involving the whole bus. same with trucks, trailers and even cement mixers. lol i once saw 2 mixers having a race :D. then there are those STUPID van drivers. they are bloody quick but like in abu dhabi there should be a rule in other states banning them from the fast lane. rudeboy taxi drivers, van drivers, truck drivers, bus drivers, Batrol drivers (locals), cruiser drivers (locals) are responsible for major accidents on the roads. bus drivers drive at bloody 120km/hr and the bus is packed with over 20 labourers in it and imagine a major accident involving the whole bus. same with trucks, trailers and even cement mixers. lol i once saw 2 mixers having a race :D. then there are those STUPID van drivers. they are bloody quick but like in abu dhabi there should be a rule in other states banning them from the fast lane. reviewer
Ok....ok..slow down mate :lol: :lol: :lol: you're on Mach 3 already....we see your point obviously 3x...... :D rudeboy ooops sorry how did that happen :S i clicked the submit button only once :S. reviewer The least is you made yourself heard very..very loud and clear..... :lol: :lol: reviewer
Are you counting out any european expats and anyone from down under in the pile up........?



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