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bear wrote:Yes, the Cayenne is a good looking card. Yes, it is fast (0-60 in 9.1 and a top speed of 214 mph). Yes, there are a wide variety of kits and modifications that make it even better looking and faster. But no, it does not work properly off road. It’s been built as a luxury card for upper class soccer moms and ballet dads to cart their children around in style.

Amen to that.

bear wrote:Something that everyone seems to be forgetting about the 911 with a backpack, unless they have somehow rectified the issue, is that it does not have the traction required to keep a car like that safe off-road.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the stock wheel option is a 20inch wheel with low profiles. Low Profiles have shallow treads. While that may be optimal on a fast car driving on asphalt, it’s just as good as driving racing slicks off road.

I once saw a test drive from the good fellows at Top gear, in which they raced a Cayenne S over a gravel track against a sky diver in a squirrel suit; The fastest that Richard Hammond could get was 30 mph and even then was having trouble controlling the car. Though the Cayenne does have the stopping power of the 911, which is formidable, off road driving requires at least medium tread tires, on sand even more so than on gravel. That is all without getting into the suspension travel, which I am assuming is not very much since there is only about 4 inches between the circumference of the tire and the fender well thanks to those 20's.

Yes, the Cayenne is a good looking card. Yes, it is fast (0-60 in 9.1 and a top speed of 214 mph). Yes, there are a wide variety of kits and modifications that make it even better looking and faster. But no, it does not work properly off road. It’s been built as a luxury card for upper class soccer moms and ballet dads to cart their children around in style.

Hello,
With all due respect Mr Bear, I don’t intend to disgrace your opinion. As I highly appreciate that you contributed here sparing your precious time. However it feels that some points are very falsely estimated, I agree to the fact that the Cayenne is expensive to maintain to some extent but I’d like to add that it too depends upon the owner. What I don’t agree is that on WHAT basis you stated regarding the Cayenne as:
“Especially when you know that it’s been designed with the wrong wheels, tires, and suspension”
This remark is an insult to German engineering! As to how they might design a four wheel car with an inappropriate driving dynamics! This is absolutely not acceptable by any one who is aware of the engineering put behind the Cayenne! Before I say anything further I would like to brief out some essentials which I believe would help you discover the Cayenne in a rather appropriate manner!

Specifications comparing Nissan Patrol, Toyota Land Cruiser and the Porsche Cayenne (all 2006):

Wheelbase for Patrol: 2,970mm
Wheelbase for Land Cruiser: 1,925mm
Wheelbase for Cayenne: 2,855mm

Height of the car (Ground clearance): Patrol is 1,855mm
Land Cruiser is 1295mm
Cayenne is 1,700mm

Tyres: Cayenne (all season 17’’ alloy rims) 20’’ are as an option on Cayenne S and Turbo versions my dear friend.
Patrol (17’’ x 8JJ light alloy rims)
Land Cruiser (16’’ 5 spoke light alloys)

Engine spec. top ranges. Patrol S.Safari ( In-Line 6 cylinders 4,759 cc 4.7 Litres 280bhp )
Land Cruiser VXR ( V8 4.7 Litres, 240 bhp @ 4800rpm)
Cayenne S ( V8 4.2 Litres, 340 bhp @ 6000rpm )

As far as my knowledge goes considering the facts above, I literally find Cayenne S powerful enough overtake other two vehicles. Now in driving dynamics I see only 155mm difference between Cayenne and Patrol! Never the less Cayenne is 405mm higher than Land Cruiser!!!

(Off topic: we spand most of our times in the city! There hardly once in a while we go desert safari! And with that in mind I think Cayenne and Patrol are good!)

Now coming to the point where you said “Correct me if I'm wrong, but the stock wheel option is a 20inch wheel with low profiles” Well my dear friend I’m afraid you are wrong! Unlike Patrol and Land Cruiser where there are only two (2) alloy types available, Cayenne on the other hand has thirteen (13) varieties of alloys to choose from, 16’’ all terrain (off-road) alloys to 21’’ Gambella sports edition with low-profile tyres. It is meant for different types of people, some may choose better road handling, some might go for more off-roading so that is why Porsche has one of the most vast rang of accessories and vehicle types for the people to get the exact type of vehicle they want!!! As far as the suspensions are concerned the Cayenne has 500mm and 550mm (air suspension) of wading depth (higher than Patrol and Land Cruiser) and if the Cayenne is set to Terrain II level than the ground clearance further exceeds to 273mm (which again is quite higher that Patrol and LC) Therefore when driving Cayenne off road only a dedicated ultra sensitive computer sensors can detect the difference between some mm change in wheelbase, height, curb weight, and ground clearance between these three vehicles, not humans! We would never feel this slight difference, and it would not affect the over-all performance of these 3 vehicles at all!
The renowned engineering from Germany and other European nations has always proven to be the best, comparing with Japanese engineering is alright, but legitimately stating that Japanese are The Best is pointless, Japanese started manufacturing cars long after their European masters did. They inherited every aspect of automobile engineering from their European and American masters. Yet they have to go a long way till they reach the point where they are head-to-head to German engineering!

I cannot comment of Mr Richard Hammond’s driving a Porsche Cayenne at hardly 40m/h that too with great difficulty controlling! But I drove my friend’s Cayenne S in ‘Al Falaj’ near Masafi desert at nearly 80 km/h!! But I still consider my self a beginner in desert driving, you should see how my friend drives, don’t mind but if an Emarati local was driving Cayenne, than you would’ve know how it is to drive a real off-road style. Ask any local friend if you have one, and dare him to drive the Cayenne V6, and he’ll defeat the Patrol and Land Cruiser V8 on that!! There are various factors involved in driving a certain type of vehicle and judging it honestly by its quality but not just by price.
European engineering is beyond compare!! And Porsche Cayenne is ONE of the most reliable and outstanding 4x4 in the world no doubt!
You have to appreciate the goodness of a particular car if you're broad-minded person
cheers

Salman buddy,

I never said the Cayenne was a bad car, i said it was no good off-road. I've never been impressed by european engineered cars. However, if i had to choose one, it would most definately not be a Cayenne, it would be a Landrover

Let me put it this way.

You are driving a 4x4 offroad at modest pace - say 40 kmh. You hit a solid obstacle square on that is 30 cm high.

If you have independent front suspension both front wheels will pop up in the air but your chassis will barely lift and you will rip the front diff off into the sand.

If you have a solid beam axle the front end of your 4x4 will pop into the air, you may or may not damage your tyres but the truck will be fine.

Cayennes and some Landcruisers (the fancy pants ones) come with independent front suspension. Base model Landcruisers come with a solid beam front axle.

And that is why I will never drive deep into the desert or outback without a 4x4 with a solid front axle.

bear wrote:Salman buddy,

I never said the Cayenne was a bad car, i said it was no good off-road. I've never been impressed by european engineered cars. However, if i had to choose one, it would most definately not be a Cayenne, it would be a Landrover

Hi there, well still I honour your choice mate, Land Rover is a though 4x4 indeed. The LR3 and the new Outlander are brilliant work of English engineering, infact the LR3 can go upto 4 feet of depth in the water which is certainly most impressive. However I am not sure if you had experienced the Porsche Cayenne personally, but I asure you! Once you've driven it in the sand. You'll definately change your mind
See my point is, that people still take German engineering for granted! With out any solid reason, we have to broaden our thinking power. We just consider the price factor and after-sales expenses, there's been a revolution in Europe for automobile engineering to prove that it is indeed the best. Take any brand of European vehicle of recent models and compare it with the old generation of European vehicles, you will find a drastic change in terms of design, technology put behind, sophistication in the vehicle and so on.
The problem is UAE is that people mostly buy used 2nd or 3rd hand european vehicle of previous generations, which are likely to break-down every 5000 kms, because if we buy a used car, we can never judge how the previous owner would've driven it (i mean rash, smooth or normal) so temporarily we might find engines in good condition (cheating to the buyer) but after some time we find car breaking-down all of a sudden.
Therefore the overall impression of european vehicles is not good.

Finally mate, if you want to get most out of German or other European car, I strongly suggest that when ever you buy, buy it brand-new 0km from the showroom
cheers