Forced mariage stoped by Australian court

Bora_Bora

It sounds like a sensible move to me. The devil will be in the detail - but I'm sure this will get the support of Imams etc as well. The Tribals won't be happy though.

Cheers,
Shafique

"Tribals" in the UK??? 😮 Are they behind those "marry for money/passport" sham marriages????

shafique

No, those are just crooks. The Tribals are those who think the Taliban are too soft!

Cheers,
Shafique

Bora_Bora

No, those are just crooks. The Tribals are those who think the Taliban are too soft!

Cheers,
Shafique

Sorry, you lost me. 😕 What does that have to do with Australia stopping forced marriages??

shafique

Sorry Bora - I was replying to gertrude's post about the proposed change in the law in the UK to outlaw forced marriages. The 'Tribals' that I said won't be happy referred to those in the UK who think forced marriages are ok - contrary to what Islam teaches.

Cheers,
Shafique

patience

Ok don't really like to get involved with the Politics forum or do any major googling but just had a quick look at forced marriages in the UK. "The majority of these seem to be within the Pakistani community" a telegraph article said. The BBC said that the FMU reported up to 65% of all known cases involve pakistanis. Just by looking at the articles for the UK would seem to imply that the majority of forced marriages (at least in the UK) are from the Muslim community. It also states that it is against Islam to subject anyone to a forced marriage and that each party must consent. Personally I think forced marriages are abhorrent we should all be free to make our own mistakes. 😀

shafique

Patience - yes, there is indeed a problem amongst some Pakistani families in the UK. I made specific reference to this in my first post. I don't think it should be over-blown though, in terms of numbers, but it is serious and abhorent for each case. Forced is different from arranged - and Islam requires consent for marriage.

I'll have to check with my wife if I'm free to make my own mistakes. 😁 😁

Cheers,
Shafique

kanelli

Here is a recent Newsweek article - one Sikh woman tells the story of forced marriage for her and the other daughters in her family. http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2011/09/18/forced-marriage-and-honor-killings-happen-in-britain-u-s-too.html

Here are examples of forced marriage around the world, compiled by The Forced Marriage Prevention Initiative, http://forcedmarriage.wordpress.com/case-examples/

And there are cases of men being forced into marriage because they are gay or have a disability and the family wants a wife to take over the care-giving duties - examples from the UK's ForcedMarriage.net, http://www.forcedmarriage.net/casestudy1.html

Forced marriage is a cultural problem and for purposes of family honour (so kids don't get a bad reputation for sleeping around with boy/girlfriends and producing children out of wedlock), strategic reasons like family or business alliances, covering up a child's hom.o.se.xuality, pawning the care of a sick/disabled/mentally ill child onto a spouse. Most definitely religion is used as an excuse to get a child to comply with the marriage. However, I challenge anyone to find a religion that states that underage boys and girls must be forced into marriage or they are breaking the rules of their God.

desertdudeshj

I'm all for it, this law should have come into effect a long time back and more countries should adopt it. And K is also correct just like honour killings not matter how much the phobes would like it to be its not a muslim "thing" Its a cultral thing and indeed a highly shamefull and criminal act.

gertrude

However, I challenge anyone to find a religion that states that underage boys and girls must be forced into marriage or they are breaking the rules of their God.

Mulsims follow the teachings of a man who married a 6 years old girl, and had $ex with with her when she turned 9. Therefore one can tell Islam is a pretty strong endorsment of forced marriage and statutory rape. Unless you find it normal for a man to have $ex with an underage girl. By any mean, this man in the West ,would serv a long prison term, don't you agree?

shafique

Loons really are gullible.

However, I am never failed to be amused when they start repeating their spin on Islam and political marriages in the past (whilst remaining silent on exactly the same marriages in Europe centuries after the Prophet's marriages) . 😉

Someone correct me, but didn't Richard II of England marry a child - IIRC Isabel of France was only 7 or 8 when they were married. This was a few centuries after Islam - so I wouldn't be surprised if the imaginative loon posters blamed Islam for this marriage! 😀

Edit: It seems the Romans were also at it - the custom in the Eastern Roman ('Byzantine') empire from the late 12th century:

Child brides, whether Byzantines or foreign princesses, were the norm rather than the exception, especially from the late twelfth century. Irene Ducaena, wife of Alexius I Comnenus, was twelve at her marriage, and empress before she was fifteen; the Byzantine princess Theodora, Manuel's niece, was in her thirteenth year when she married Baldwin III of Jerusalem; and Margaret-Maria of Hungary married Isaac II Angelus at the age of nine.

http://www.roman-emperors.org/aggiefran.htm

dubai-chat/cops-spying-emiratis-t47332-165.html

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

I don't worship any man. I think you're confused (as usual) caps.

But you're right - not many Europeans marry 7 year olds today. But they did. How many Muslims do you know who today follow Richard II's example? Why did he marry a 7 year old?

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

You could have just said 'No, I don't know of any Muslims following the example of Richard the II'.

The correct answer to why Richard II married a 7 year old is - 'It was a political marriage'.

(You're welcome)

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

No.

Simple answer to a simple question.

But more to the point, Islam does not condone pre-marital s.ex, under aged s.ex or forced marriages. Despite what loons want to believe.

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

🙄 Please re-read the last sentence of my last post. Then read the sentence before that.

Can you now see why you've failed?

Now - the fact is that Richard II etc married young girls for political reasons. This was in Europe centuries after the Prophet, pbuh, had passed away. The Prophet, pbuh, entered into a number of political marriages - including divorcees and widows.

Facts caps, facts - the achilles heel of loons, again.

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

So, you'd argue that Richard II was a paedophile for entering into an arranged marriage with a 7 year old for political reasons. Hmm.

However, my point still stands:
Islam does not condone forced marriages, under-age s.ex. Despite what loons argue.

Cheers,
Shafique

Flying_Dutchman

the achilles heel of loons, again.

I'd say the very weak spot of Islam is Muhammed's dirty deeds. Thats why Muslims get so violent when people get close to Muhammed (try to draw him for example). Deep down they know something is very wrong, and in the end that is a good thing and hopefull

shafique

Another loon fantasy that is not based on reality.

The problem with the loon version of history is that Muslims don't actually believe the loon version, nor do they act upon it. Muslims instead consider the Prophet, pbuh, to embody all the virtues of a moral, just, loving, compassionate, loyal, brave, spiritual human being.

The fact remains that Islam does not condone under-age s.ex or forced marriages.

Centuries after the Prophet, pbuh, had passed on - European and Eastern Monarchs were entering into political marriages with child brides.

Cheers,
Shafique

Flying_Dutchman

Muslims instead consider the Prophet, pbuh, to embody all the virtues of a moral, just, loving, compassionate, loyal, brave, spiritual human being.

Muhammed was a war monger womanizer to put it mildly. Responsible amongst others for genocide and ethnic cleansing.

The fact remains that Islam does not condone under-age s.ex or forced marriages.

Islam doesn't condone pre-menstrual se.x, thats something very different!

shafique

Yes, we know what the loon version of history is and how they demonise Muhammad, pbuh.

As stated above, Muslims don't believe the loon spin and in all the accusations you've levelled against the historical events, the loon spin was exposed.

In this case, child marriages for political reasons was being carried out in Europe centuries after the Prophet, pbuh, had passed away. This is fact.

So, the smear of paedophilia is a cynical one that is not based on fact. Especially when the other wives and when they were married are taken into account.

Islam does not condone s.ex outside of marriage - as everyone knows. And it does not condone forced marriages.

Cheers,
Shafique

Flying_Dutchman

In this case, child marriages for political reasons was being carried out in Europe centuries after the Prophet, pbuh, had passed away. This is fact.

How weak Islam is, needing to find reassurance constantly from European princes and kings. 💡

So, the smear of paedophilia is a cynical one that is not based on fact. Especially when the other wives and when they were married are taken into account.

What a strange and weak argument. Many modern day pedophiles are legally married.

Islam does not condone s.ex outside of marriage

It does condone se.x as soon as mentruation happened, and many consider that statutary rape!

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